Seeking a 19th Century French Connection.

[Greenbank]

I am trying to research my wife's French ancestors who include Valentin Eugene Massot born on 1st December 1872 in St. Martin de Connee in the Canton of Bais in the Departement of Mayenne.  After military service with the French Army he came to England where he married and raised a large family. I have his full family records in England and also found his birth certificate and military record in the Departement of Mayenne records.  The birth certificate records his father as also Valentin Massot, a moulder age 28 (giving a birth year of 1844) who later lived in Port Brillet in the Canton of Lorion, also in Mayenne.  His mother was Marie Vazeux age 26 (giving a birth year of 1846).  I have been unable to find details of the parents' births, marriage or deaths or of any other children on searching on Geneanet or Ancestry.  Any help or advice would be much appreciated as I seem to have hit a 'brick wall'.    'Greenbank'

[jorose]

I take it you have his records for here?
http://www.lamayenne.fr/fr/Archives53/Archives-en-ligne

It is likely that geneanet/ancestry will not have any records indexed, but with the amount available on the online archives you should be able to find something.  Have you searched the tables décennales for both St. Martin and Port Brillet to see if there are any other Massots or Vazeux families in the area? Often records will have witnesses on so you may, for example, find Valentin (Sr or Jr) listed as a witness to the marriage or death of a close family member.

I have often found with my lot that families moved between communes frequently - perhaps they lived in an area close to commune boundaries - and sometimes just checking each neighbouring commune in turn is required to figure out where they'd escaped to.

You should also look at the recensement for Port Brillet in 1891, which is on that site (but not name searchable), since upon joining the military in 1892 at the usual age, he and both parents were residing in Port Brillet.

Didn't see him, but on page 24/36 are:
Valentin Massot, 47
Marie Vaseux, 44
Ernest Massot, 7

The same three (but not Valentin? - away for schooling somewhere?) are on the 1886 recensement (22/36)

In 1881 are (page 14/30)
Valentin Massot, 37
Marie Vaseux, 35
Valentin, 9
Marie, 2M

[jorose]

Port Brillet indexes, births/deaths Massot
Jacques, d. 21 Jul 1880 - no birth (interesting!)
Marie Alphonsine Louise, b. 25 April 1881, d. 24 Feb 1882

Putting wee Marie to one side, Jacques is interesting as there's no obvious birth for him, making him either a child born somewhere else or another relative.

The original shows that Valentin Massot, 36, a moulder, was one of the two witnesses who registered this death and he is listed as son of the deceased, the other witness being a neighbour.  Jacques Massot was aged 72, b. Saint-Symphorien in Sarthe.  He was the son of Jacques Massot and Marie Galliot, both deceased in Tennie, Sarthe.  He was the widower of Marie Andree, who died at St. Martin de Connee.

So now we have a whole set of other locations to examine - note that the locations in Sarthe are not that far away, just a jump over the departmental borders really.

For marriages you can search here:
http://www.lamayenne.fr/fr/Archives53/Archives-en-ligne/Etat-civil/Mariages-du-XIXeme-siecle
I can see that the marriage of Valentin and wife took place at the start of 1872.  Her first names are listed as "Nathalie Appoline" on the index, but I believe it must be the same couple.  It is not unusual for people to have multiple first names (baptismal names, etc), but to use only one or two in daily life so this is important to watch out for.

He is "Valentin Felix Pierre" - born "St Aubin", 10 May 1844 (-du-Desert, I think, squinting at the placename) here.  Parents Jacques Massot and Marie Andree.  "Nathalie Appoline Marie Anne" was b. Saint-Thomas-de-Courceriers June 1846, her father Pierre (deceased in Saint-Thomas-de-Courceriers) and her mother Appoline Bouvier (still living in Saint-Thomas-de-Courceriers).

There's also indexed the 1867 marriage of a Marie Massot, another child of Jacques and Marie Andree.  I'm sure the database of marriages is not complete so you will probably have to check through Saint-Thomas-de-Courceriers.

Anyway, I'll leave the rest for you to explore - you should be able to find Marie Andree's death (likely to be listed under "Andree" not "Massot") and the Vazeux family in  Saint-Thomas-de-Courceriers.

[Oakheart]

Hi,

I've searched through the records ( no index the originals ) and pretty much found what Jorose found except for one or two things.


So for the birth of MASSOT Valentin in December 1872, he was born the first and recorded the 2nd.
The information you have are correct.
The witnesses are MARIANNE or MARIONNE Michel Léon the public teacher, 45 year old and ? FOUILTEUT ? Victor, 49 year old farmer.

I found the marriage certificate for MASSOT Valentin and VASEUX Nathalie Appoline Marie Anne. I don't translate it all but I give you the lines :

27th January 1872, 4pm.

" I Arsène Mouton having the quality of public officer of St-Martin-de-la-Connée received : "

MASSOT Valentin Félix Pierre, 27 year old moulder living at Orthe in the village ( Orthe is a hamlet )
born at Saint-Aubin-du-Désert May 10th 1844 according to the birth certificate he presented. Son of MASSOT Jacques, 63 year old carpenter ANDRE Marie, no profession 61 years old. They seem to be alive though they are not said to be present.

VASEUX Natalie ( written this way this time ) Appoline Marie Anne, 25 year old cook living at Orthe in this village. Born at Saint-Thomas-de-Courceriers, June 2nd 1846. Daughter of the late VASEUX Pierre who died at St-Thomas April 1st 1863 and BOUVIER Appoline, no profession, 47 year old living at St-Thomas.

Then there is an explanation saying that all documents are conform, no opposition to the union. They both say yes to each other?

Presence of MARIONNE Michel Léon, public teacher, 44 year old.
SIMON René, carpenter, 49.
PRUDHOMME Frédéric, carpenter, 28.
BESNARD Jean-Baptiste, 49 ( could not read his trade ).

They all signed.

This record is available at Saint-Martin-de-la-Connée's records, page 456 for the 1863-1872 registre. 


So that opens a lot of opportunity with birth dates/places and the death date of Nathalie's father.

Geneanet and Ancestry are good but most departments offer parish and civil records available online for free like for yours. But you need to read/understand French though. If you want more help you can ask again or by private message. I hope this helps

[Greenbank]

Hi Jorose and Oakheart,

Thank you very much indeed for letting me know how to proceed and for including such a wealth of information already!  I shall get to work and go through all the references which you have mentioned.  I will post a further reply once I've done that.  I've always felt that in a country like France it should be possible to get back to earlier generations.

With many thanks and best wishes,

Greenbank.