Please help with the date

[indaba]

Please could I have some help with the date of this photo. As yet the subject is unidentified but an approximate date will give me a good starting point.  Thanks in anticipation.

[Viktoria]

 Have a look at previous posts re dating photographs-- a clever RootsChatter was able to give the date when that style of beard which has a special  name  was  fashionable.

 Best of luck .Viktoria.

[chinakay]

  The beard is called a Newgate Frill and was fashionable from the late 1850s for a while. This photo is a typical 1860s pose and the stamp on the back is also typical 1860s. I suspect late 1860s, because there is a backdrop, which isn't seen until late in the decade. The red design around the edges is a bit unusual. Lovely photo.

Are the outer corners square? Please always show the outer corners.

Cheers,
China

[jim1]

Mmmm...Philip Joseph Lehmann was born c. 1872 Mold.
1891 lists him as a photographer in Mold aged 19.
1911 sees him as a cinematograph operator.
The cardstock on this is typically Edwardian but the backdrop is 1880's-90's. & the backstamp 1860's.
If this was a copy of an 1860's photo I would expect to see him wearing a frockcoat rather than this morning jacket which was more of an 1880's-90's style.
The clincher is that he has a separate button-hole for his watch chain which arrived late 1880's.
So putting all that together I would suggest a v. late 1880's - 1890's original.

jim

[chinakay]

I had a good look at that watch chain, Jim, and still don't see a separate hole.

Very odd that such an old stamp would still be in use that late.

[indaba]

Thanks to Veronika, China and Jim for all their input. As Jim has stated Philip Lehmann was at 22 New Street, Mold in the 1890s - he could possibly be using old cardstock - but why would he have a stamp more typical of the 1860s ?  I have now attached a photo of presumably the gentleman's wife, showing the square corners of the card,  on the off chance that her dress could perhaps confirm either of the dates.

[jim1]

It's not old cardstock as this didn't exist in the 60's.
Well there's not much to see in this as she's pretty much covered up & as an older lady would be conservative in style.
Her skirt doesn't have the fussiness of the 70's & is more in-keeping with the 80's & 90's.
Her bonnet called a toque was an 1880's fashion & still worn into the 90's.

jim

[indaba]

Thanks again - I have decided to go with the date of the very early 1890s, based mainly on the particulars of the photographer,  and I believe I have now been able to identify the couple.