Help please searching for Russian ancestors

[Noells]

I am trying to help my friend with researching her Russian ancestors. She has details only as far back as her grandfather who was born in Kharkov,Ukraine in 1873. He with his wife and family came to Oz from Harbin about 1928 and remained here, so we have their details after arriving in Oz.

I have exhausted all the usual avenues for research and can't find any Russian records. I found some for Russian/Jewish people, but they were not Jewish.

This is my last hope before admitting defeat.

Noells

[GeorgiyH]

What are the family names you are looking for?

[Noells]

Hi GeorgiyH

Not looking in Oz for anyone. The name in Russia is Vlas  Efremovich Bessmertny .

The challenge here is dealing with the patronymic names i.e.  the identifying name of a person is characterised by the name of the father.  Apparently this means that the father of Vlas was called Efrem. It is the line back from Vlas Efremovich Bessmertny we are trying to research.

Any help or guidance you can give will be appreciated.

Noells

[Ruskie]

I am trying to help my friend with researching her Russian ancestors. She has details only as far back as her grandfather who was born in Kharkov, Ukraine in 1873. He with his wife and family came to Oz from Harbin about 1928 and remained here, so we have their details after arriving in Oz.

I have exhausted all the usual avenues for research and can't find any Russian records. I found some for Russian/Jewish people, but they were not Jewish.

This is my last hope before admitting defeat.

Noells

I am in a similar position. My grandparents also came to Australia via Harbin around the same time. 

I think you need to be able to speak the language to get anywhere. I have no idea of what records were ever held (or which still exist) regarding births, marriages and deaths.

There is also the problem of names being anglicised and any variations of those names in Russia. (it's hard enough with names like Smith/Smyth/Smythe etc when you speak the language let alone having to deal with the same thing in Russian with a different alphabet.  )

Have you seen this site?:
http://www.vgd.ru/ENGLISH/b.htm
I haven't looked at in in ages but you used to be able to leave messages there in order to contact others with the same surname.

Your friend may be able to hire a local Russian researcher, though I don't know if I would feel comfortable doing this (trust issues  ). I do know that they are pretty interested in DNA so a DNA test may reveal some matches, though this is a long shot.
Finally, I don't suppose there are any stories about the family which may give any clues as to siblings etc?

Do their Australian death certificates give details of their parents? Naturalisation certificates? (which don't contain much information)

I'll be interested in any replies you receive. I have all but given up though I do occasionally have renewed interest which has never led me anywhere as yet. 

[GeorgiyH]

Yes, the father is most certainly Efrem. I imagine any Church records in Harbin will have been lost during the Cultural Revolution. Have you contacted the local Russian Orthodox Priest? They may be able to give you some pointers. Our Priest's family also came to Australia from Harbin.

[Ruskie]

I see that surname is listed in the site I provided a link to - there are a number of possible variants just to add to the confusion .... 

You are correct in thinking Vlas's father would be Efrem. I am likely to be wrong but this does sound Jewish.

Do you know what Vlas is short for? Vasil(l)y? Vladimir? Or something else?

[Ruskie]

GeorgiyH mentioned church records in Harbin - do you know where the grandparent's married or where their children were born?

[GeorgiyH]

Could just be he was born or baptised on St Ephraim's day. Vlas I am not sure of.

[Noells]

I appreciate your input and will try to answer where possible,

Don't know where the grandparents were married, but these are details for what seems to be the firstborn.
Ivan Vlasovich Bessmertny     b(??)Blagoveschensk,  died at age early 20's  during thyphoid epidemic,Blagoveschensk Russia. (This is in the far east on  the Amur River, on the border with China.
He was married with one child.

The next listing Anna Vlasevna Bessmertny b 1898 Blagoveschensk  d.1968 Azov Russia.

So they should have married around 1896? maybe.

thanks for that website -I found the surname on it - they also have Bessmertnyh listed.

Your suggestion to contact the local Russian priest- we are in Melbourne - would this be the one we contact?

I also thought Efrem was jewish

I haven't asked my friend if she speaks Russian. She was born in Oz. She will be very pleased when I let her know about your help.

thanks again
Noells