Robert James Walker Gateshead circa 1929

[Tickettyboo]

I have a great uncle who is noted in the Jun 1921 Census of England & Wales residing at 82 School Terrace, Gateshead

Robert James Walker 29 yrs 4 months, Police Constable, Gateshead Council, Alice Lucy Walker 29yrs, 1892 born Gloucestershire.

Is there any research source/records available for Gateshead Police for 1920-1939.  He is listed later in the 1939 Register as an electric tram driver.

Tyne and Wear Archives user guides
https://twarchives.org.uk/collection/user-guides-and-information
choose the guide for Law and Order
the download happens automatically and on page 7 there is info on what they hold for Gateshead Borough Constabulary

EDIT this is their catalogue entry which gives more idea (once you drill down) of the dates ofeach type of record
https://calmview.twmuseums.org.uk/calmview/TreeBrowse.aspx?src=CalmView.Catalog&field=RefNo&key=PA.GA

NB their opening times are very limited and you have to book an appointment, it seems the originals are available to view but would need to be ordered in advance, so if you can visit I'd suggest that a one day camera licence would be your cheapest option at £10
For them to find the records for you remotely its a research charge of £30/hour and their copying charges are here
https://twarchives.org.uk/collection/copying

Boo

[Nairda]

Boo,

Thank you for your time, searches and information.  That has been helpful. 

I have also found this site https://www.gatesheadpolicehistory.org/history.  It has the Force Registers for Gateshead Police Force between 1836 to 1899 and men and women between 1900 to 1968.

Unfortunately the 1900 to 1968 register is a work in progress, last updated in 2021.

[Tickettyboo]

A few snippets of info
There is a marriage in 1914 on Scotland's People which is a contender (a copy is available on an ancestry tree) in Blythwood, Glasgow
for a Robert James Walker (? that name is not clear) and an Aiice Cox
They married by declaration on 2 Jan 1914 in the presence of David Walker ? (that name is not clear), Iron Moulder and Robert Downs, coal miner and then paid the Sheriffs Warrant to have it entered in the register on Jan 9 1914

Robert was a Bachelor, aged 21 of 2 Allan Place Longloan and gave his occupation as Bricklayers labourer - which is odd if he was still in the army ?
his parents were James Walker, farm labourer and Jane Eliza Walker Maiden Surname Connolly
Alice was 21 a domestic servant and a spinster of 4 Allan Place, Longloan
her parents were James Cox land steward and Mary Cox MS Taylor

Newcastle Evening Chronicle
4 Jun 1957, page 18 col 4
Deaths
WALKER  Lobley Hill, 25 Cragside Gardens June 2 (suddenly) aged 65 years.
Robert James Beloved husband of Alice and dear father of Veronica, Beatrice and George and grandchildren
Cremation West Road Thursday 1.35 leaving residence 12.45 for service at All Saints Church 1pm. Funeral private.

EDIT - wrong link, sorry, will go look for the right one!
West Road Crematorium, Newcastle, index to cremations
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3QHV-P3VC-J54V?i=10&cat=828657
Added
and I did look, but must have had a senior moment when I got that entry its a different man with the same name who died over a year later and though I have tried I can't find the index entries for 'W' in 1957, sorry. I think they may have been missed from the filming. `this is the catalogue entry if anyone else wants to have a go.
https://www.familysearch.org/search/catalog/828657?availability=Family%20History%20Library

entry in West Road Book of Remembrance
https://www.remembrance-books.com/Newcastle/pages/060201l.jpg

Newcastle Evening Chronicle
2 Jun 1958, page 15 col 1
In Memoriam
WALKER (Lobley Hill) Treasured memories of my darling husband and father Robert James died June 2 1957.
We often think of you and think of how you died, To think you could not say goodbye before you closed your eyes.
God took you home it was His Will, But why so sudden we wonder still. Forget him no, we never shall. So dearly loved and missed by your loving wife, daughters, sons, daughters in law, sons in law and grandchildren.

Newcastle Evening Chronicle
2 Jun 1959, page 14 col 4
In Memoriam
WALKER (Lobley Hill) In loving memory of father, Robert James, died June 2 1957, We are thinking of you dear father. Thinking of the past. Seeing you in memory as we saw you last. Loved and remembered by his daughter Beatrice son in law Arthur and grandchildren.

and apologies, I did know about that gateshead police history site but also knew that the time frame you need isn't yet available. May be worth contacting them though to enquire if/when it will be updated.

Boo

[Tickettyboo]

A little more corroboration
The 2 pension index cards for Robert James Walker, Pte 3436 of the Irish Guards
1 says he's to get 13/- a week from 07.08.19 and his address on that one is c/o/ Chief Constable, Gateshead, Co Durham
so that fits in with him being a policeman in 1921

and the other gives year of birth as 1892, Pte 3436 Irish Guards, married
pension to start 07.02.1919 , disability Gun Shot Wound to knee
and an address of 19 Hylton Street, Gateshead on Tyne

Boo

[Nairda]

Thanks again for your research.  The wedding in Scotland is a mystery?  All the names/relationships seem correct?  Yet occupation is incorrect.  The mother has already given birth to two children in Ireland (David in Jun 1912) (Emily Veronica 19 Dec 1914) Interestingly on the birth record for 1914 it is recorded that Robert is at the front in Flanders.  In 1912 she signs the Ulster Covenant as Alice Lucy Walker and the birth in 1912 mother is recorded as Alice Walker nee Cox.

So the marriage and its location in Scotland seems at mystery?  He enlisted in Irish Guards in 1909, had children to Alice Lucy back in his home at Scarva in Ireland during his time in the army.

[Tickettyboo]

Do you have Robert James' service record? Where does the info about when he enlisted come from?
Do you know his occupation prior to enlisting?
Have you found Alice in any census returns, in any country :-) prior to the 1921 you mentioned?

I agree that its puzzling, but its not the  first time I've seen a marriage 'after' the first couple of children.
Many theoretical (but probably not provable) scenarios
1 He gave his pre army, civil occupation
2 They had previously (before the children) married in Scotland by declaration, but not had it entered in the register. Then when war was becoming more likely they did it again, this time getting a certificate as they wanted to make  things official.
3 One or the other had previously been legally married and either this was technically a bigamous marriage (again in light of him possibly being killed in battle) or the previous spouse had died and they were then both free to marry?

As I said, everything is possible but proving it is a different matter.

If the parents of the couple are correct then that would be a big plus for this being your couple though

Boo

[Nairda]

i don't have his service record.  The date of enlistment came from his Silver Wound Badge record as 10/09/1909 discharged 06/08/1919.  He would have been 17 on enlistment.  Haven't found Alice in census returns.
From another site picked up that Hope Street, Glasgow was some form of pre registrars office or solicitors office that officially recognised a marriage via a Warrant of Sheriffs Substitute. 
I therefore, surmise he possibly didn't have formal permission to marry as he was in the army and gave the Bricklayers Labourer to cover for being a soldier.  As the outbreak of war was likely he probably wanted a formal record of marriage as two children had already been born in the event of his death in service.  The other site referred to a Scots Guardsman in London and a maid travelling to Hope Street in similar circumstances.