watson family in essex?

[Jonson1]

Hi-googling Thomas Creswick Watson, found this thread which may be out of date now. I am a descendant and have his portrait, as well as the 1811 commission when promoted to Captain. He did not come from Essex and the property mentioned in his will was near Wrexham.

His son Lieutenant George Watson went to Australia with his large family and a descendant produced a family tree in 1979, having tracked the progeny of all children. Think that Queencorgi1 mentioned a son Henry born in Nottingham(?) and that is very unlikely as George not there and no son called Henry. His children were all given the name Cobham in honour of their Grandmother's family.

Some other information I didn't know about. Thanks.

[queencorgi1]

Hi Jonson1
Henry Watson was a foreman carpenter and the direct ancestor of my husband. To my utter astonishment, when I obtained his marriage certificate (1859) I found that he had given his father's name as 'Lt George Watson of the 3rd Light Dragoons'. After more investigation I discovered that he and his two siblings George and Elizabeth Watson were all baptised in Radford, Notttinghamshire. Lt George Watson was named as their father in each case. Their mother was Mary Ann Wade, who was 19 when she gave birth to Elizabeth, her eldest child. Lt Watson was 36 and already had seven children with his wife. Throughout the 1830s the 3rd Light Dragoons, like other cavalry regiments, were not used to fight Britain's enemies but to control social unrest in Ireland, Scotland and northern England. In 1830 the regiment moved to Nottingham (Radford is very close by), and this probably when Lt Watson met Mary Ann. The following year the regiment moved to Piershill Barracks in Edinburgh. Both Henry and George Watson stated throughout their lives when filling in census returns that they were born in Scotland. Baptism does not have to follow immediately on birth, and what seems to have happened is that Mary Ann took the children back to her parents in Radford where they were baptised. In 1836 the regiment was posted to Ireland, and after this date I have found no trace of Mary Ann Wade. However, her three children remained with her parents. They all three learnt to read and write, and achieved reasonable success in life, good for the grandchildren of a farm labourer. George became a head gardener, Elizabeth a teacher and Henry a foreman carpenter. I think it's possible that Lt Watson arranged for regular payments to be paid to the Wades to support the children. In 1839, as you are aware, Lt Watson emigrated to Australia.

[Jonson1]

Hi Queencorgi1
Your reply has given me a lot to take in! It really does look as if Lt George Watson (presumably there can't have been two Lt George Watsons in the 3rd Light Dragoons at that time) was fathering two families at the same time and I am sorry to have been a bit dismissive in my previous post. I have looked through your various threads on this subject and it does seem feasible with the various places the regiment was sent to.  Coincidentally my grandmother on my father's side came from a Nottingham lace making family and her birth was registered at Radford.

George Watson was a gt gt gt grandfather on my mother's side and I have always been interested in him since John Watson did a family history, printed in 1979.  A number of his dates have proved wrong and a lot more information has appeared and so I am started to update his history.  Other descendants and myself have managed to find out so much more about him, his wife and his time in Australia. It all makes for a fascinating story. George fathering a second family in England/Scotland shouldn't surprise us as there is something that we haven't been able to understand about his second marriage and third family. John may have 'fudged' this by adjusting a few dates, but the documents, now seen, do not bear out his interpretation of events.

George Watson, his wife Ann Percival (nee Martyr) and 7 children set sail for Australia 8th April 1839 from Plymouth in the Strathfieldsaye. Her sister Mary Martyr accompanied them. The ship arrived in Sydney after a speedy voyage on the 25th July.  Mary Martyr gave birth to a daughter, Ada Georgina Watson, on the 1st January 1840 (no certificate but entry in family bible). Ann Percival gave birth to her last child and my gt gt grandmother, Ellen Emma Cobham Watson, on the 8th September 1841 (certificate). Ann Percival Watson died 5th August 1843 at their home on the Manning River north of Sydney (announcement in paper). George Watson married Mary Martyr 31st October 1844 in Sydney (certificate) and she gave birth to a daughter Rose Bertha Watson the 11th or 14th January 1845 (christened 8th July 1845 in Sydney). Another son Albert was born in probably 1846, but we have not been able to find any reference to this.

For the past few years it has seemed to us that George was having an affair with his wife's sister, but we have been trying to find another explanation for this chronology.  In light of your revelation, perhaps it was true! Whatever the truth, he was obviously respected as his son Joseph wrote in 1866 - "There were a great many people at the funeral. He was very much liked by everyone and will be very much missed, for he was like a King in Lexton. Everyone looked up to him".

George let very little money at his death and I think that it was unlikely that he was able to send money back to another family in England. In fact he nearly went bankrupt in the early years as he was unable to repay a loan for land in 1842. I wonder whether he kept touch with them.

[queencorgi1]

Hi Jonson1
Thank you for your most interesting post. Yes, it does sound plausible that George was something of a ladies' man, given the children's birthdates! One feels the atmosphere on board ship would have been pretty tense between the two sisters.
No, I don't think George would have kept in touch with his Nottinghamshire offshoots once he left, but I did think he might have left a lump sum with their grandparents which could have been used to pay a penny for Sunday school (often the only source of learning to read and write), or to buy tools, which for a carpenter in particular was a big investment.
In your previous post you mentioned a family estate near Wrexham. I couldn't take the Watsons further back than Paul Watson, father of Thomas Creswick Watson. Paul was the son of Robert and born in York in 1746, but that was the furthest I got. (As you will be aware, Paul became first a scrivener and then a tax collector in Lichfield. This was an important position at the time because smuggling was at its height.) If you know anything further back than Robert -- or anything about Robert -- I should be interested to know, just for the sake of completeness.
You may be amused to learn that my husband is also descended from Matthew Prizeman, who was transported to Van Diemen's Land in 1850 and later settled with his family in New South Wales. In addition, I am descended from Henry Bull, transported to Melbourne in 1847, so therefore our children have three links with Australia!
Thank you again for your informative and fascinating post.
With very best wishes
queencorgi1

[Jonson1]

Hi Queencorgi1
To try to answer your queries first. My information on Thomas Creswick Watson comes mostly from the research done by John Watson in the 1970s. He was with the Australian High Commission in London and used to come and stay with my family. He found that Thomas Watson retired to a small country house near Wrexham called Wynnstay Place (named after a neighbouring estate), before moving to Old Cavendish Street in London at the end of his life. When he died in 1831, the Wrexham property was valued at £3,200 and he also had nearly £4,000 invested in government bonds. He bequeathed this property to his wife for her lifetime and then to his son. She died in 1838 and this is presumably the time that George Watson began to think of a move to Australia. Perhaps he was able to provide some money for his illegitimate children at that time, as his finances would have been a bit stretched before then as a half pay officer.

I think that you know more about Thomas Watson's antecedents than I do, as I have been rather lazy about pursuing them. John said that 19th century Watsons in Australia adopted the crest and arms of a Watson family of Silsden in Yorkshire, but, without further research, this connection is doubtful.  His first Watson is Paul Watson, father of Thomas, who he had down as being born in Rotherham in 1746 and married to Susanna Creswick, again at Rotherham, in February 1768. A number of children were born to this marriage, before Susanna died in 1786. Paul married again in 1787, Judith Wrigglesworth. For occupation, John has him down first as a scrivener, then as an excise officer in Sheffield (a slightly wider description than tax collector), and finally as a plater.
John only found one sibling for George Watson, a sister Susanna born in 1790 who married a Mr Beaumont of Sheffield. No further information and he even spelt Thomas's wife as Rebecca.

My researches have been more involved with George Watson and his descendants, and his wife Ann's family. The Martyrs were prominent builders and solicitors in Greenwich outside London and her mother's father, Thomas Cobham, had been a doctor in North Carolina before having to leave due to the American War of Independence.  One of Ann's brothers, Alexander Cobham Martyr (later Cobham), inherited an estate and fortune from a Cobham cousin and my family are still in touch with his descendants. A sister, Cecilia Cobham Martyr, married the self styled Count Bertolacci who was Master of Horse to King Louis Philippe of France.

I wonder whether my gt gt grandmother, Ellen Emma Cobham Watson, knew of her half sisters and brothers in England. She was sent back to England for schooling and met her future husband, John Bell Chirnside, on the ship back to Australia in 1858.  The Chirnsides had large land holdings in Victoria and my gt gt grandfather had a property at West Charlton which he managed in conjunction with some of his Watson brothers in law. Although he and his family moved to England in the 1860s, he later on had a station at Bealiba in Victoria which was not sold until 1907 after his death.

I guess that you live in Australia, but don't know which state.

With best wishes
Jonson1   

[queencorgi1]

Hi Jonson1

Fascinating account of the Watson descendants, and it is interesting to learn more too about the Martyr family. I didn't know about Thomas's country house, and he was clearly very well off by the time he died. I agree with you, though -- I don't think the Watsons could boast any armorial connections!

No, I don't live in Australia, but in the UK.

With very best wishes
queencorgi1

[DeannaB]

Hello, I am a descendant of George Watson. His son Alexander Cobham Watson was my great great grandfather.  I have a very old large photo album from my family, but there are no names written on the photos. I hope someone might be able to help identify the photos.  I have a very old photo which I think could be Alexander Cobham Watson holding a fluffy dog.  Also, I have been to the grave of Alexander Cobham Watson, his wife Alice Hetherington and their son William Stanley Watson (my great grandfather) which is in Brighton Cemetery, Melbourne.

[queencorgi1]

Hi there! I started this thread off. I suspect the person most likely to help you is Jonson1 (see this thread), you could send a PM. Everything I have about the Watsons is (a) in this thread and (b) the wrong side of the blanket! Good luck with identifying your photographs.

[sarah]

Welcome to RootsChat Deanna

queencorgi1 please remember that new members are not able to access the pm function until they have made a couple of posts.

I have just heard back that jonson has changed his contact details, I have updated his details and sent him an email to notify him of Deanna's reply.

Regards

Sarah