Looking for Mary and Jane Fitzpatrick

[AMBLY]

What a find Rosie   
Sounds very promising to me!:

I just saw yr reply as I was abt to post the following;  still posting: 

They have common names…..the fact your girls were born in England would actually set them apart somewhat in the US Census, if they were in the New York area in 1900 and still as FITZPATRICK - but that's only if they told the truth on census (or their employer's did).

There is no way to tell if these two young women on the Cymric are yours.
In fact the passenger manifest from their arrival in New York - going to a sister, last residence Ireland -  points to it not being them.  If only we could find the 1900 Census for the address' in New York given on that manifest (I believe both address' are in Manhattan - Mary's on the Hudson side, Janey's on the East River side) but I don't know if it is possible?

Though he is recorded as FITZPATRICK in the 1891 & 1901 Census, if the youngest brother Peter  in practice, changed to that of his mother's maiden name BLACK , it's entirely possible the girls did something similar once they were old enough to decide and put such a change into practice.

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=651420.0
This topic  tells that the sister Margaret married William BRENNAN (BRANNAN on the Index)  in Prescot in (June Qtr) 1901 and that she was the lass in the school in Wales in 1891. Margaret was their only sister.

Who were the witness' to her marriage?

Also, the US Census 1900 recorded the Month and Year of a person's birth. As with any Census, this information could be incorrectly recorded - but what was the exact Birth-dates of both Mary Ellen and Jane (and James, since you're also looking for him)?

Cheers
AMBLY

[MaureeninNY]

There's a Peter LOUGHRAN born 1866 (mother Mary) listed on the 1900 census for the 309 East 21st
address.
Doesn't help at all.

Maureen

[rosie17]

Thanks Ambly for the link to previous post on this family I did see a Peter Fitzpatrick on the census forms with his grandmother and wondered if this was the same family ...The Margaret as mentioned on previous posts is the one in Wales 1891 ...

[Torwoodlee]

Thank you again!  Here is some further info and questions:

Rosie, I believe you have found James Fitzpatrick!  There was only one James born in Prescot in the June Qtr of 1874.  Mary Elizabeth Fitzpatrick was his sister (I apologise for calling her Mary Ellen…another relative from the tree!)  May I ask how we can see a copy of the info about James in Canada?  We have a world subscription for FindMyPast but only one for the UK on Ancestry.  FindMyPast is difficult to navigate since they made the changes last year!

We already knew about Margaret going to the girls’ home in Wales, apparently it was not a very nice place.  She was the only one who returned to Prescot and stayed there and married William Brennan.

Ambly, Peter Fitzpatrick (Black) was the youngest of the children, a baby when his mother died.  He was the only child taken in by a blood relative.  Peter most likely changed his name because his mother was killed by his father, he lived with his maternal grandmother and his father was possibly released from prison at that point.

The Fitzpatrick girls in question were with the Ronchetti family ten years after their mother died and still kept their surname of Fitzpatrick, in fact, all of the family kept that name except for Peter (understandable for him since he lived with his deceased mother’s mother).  He would not have remembered his parents as he was a baby when the murder occurred.

Mary Elizabeth was born in the June Qtr of 1878 and Jane was born December Qtr 1879.  We don’t have any doubts that the girls on the ship were from our Fitzpatrick family.  There is no trace of the girls in the UK after the 1891 census.  We believe the transcription of them being born in Ireland is a mistake.

Borderslass 

[dbree]

Hi Borderslass,

Library and Archives Canada has James' attestion papers, and you can see them here
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01eyi/
As Rosie mentioned his papers signed Jan/1916. He gives his sister as next of kin, and
her address is....Prescot, England.

They are in the process of digitizing all WW1 service files, they should be complete by
early 2016. You will be able to view his service file for free when it is completed. I think they
are on the letter C at the moment.

Rosie....nice find.

Cheers,
DB

[Torwoodlee]

I've read James's attestation papers, looking forward to seeing his service records!

But now there is a further question.  I have to concede, I now believe that the Fitzpatrick girls who were on that ship to America may not be the ones I am looking for.  On James Fitzpatrick's Canadian WW1 Attestation papers, he lists his sister, Mary Fitzpatrick from Prescot as his next of kin.  The papers were written in 1916 so this would suggest that Mary was still in Prescot at that time.  However, we can not find her on the 1911 census.  The last time we see her is with the Ronchetti family in 1891.  The mystery is growing!

[rosie17]

Might be a possible record for James Fitzpatrick
Jas Fitzpatrick date of birth 1874 age 10 departure Liverpool arrival date 27/6/1884 Vancouver Port Quebec .....Writing hard to make out Catholic //? Party then Ottawa

James Fitzpatrick b 1874 arrival 1884 Quebec Canada
Home Children Passenger list ...Still not seeing the girls

[AMBLY]

Hi,

Rosie, I'd just found the same record for the ship 'Vancouver'  It looked a bit like "Catholic Lang Party", perhaps the name of the 'chaperone' on the voyage?

I had first found this:
1891 CENSUS CANADA:  E. Huntly, North Lanark, Ontario
Jas FITZPATRICK 17, Domestic, b England, Roman Catholic, parents b England
In household of John ROWAN 50, Farmer and his wife & 2 children

Then find - he's listed on this website:
http://www.ottawavalleyirish.com/2013/05/james-fitzpatrick-home-child.html

Cheers
AMBLY

[dbree]

Hi,

From A*, there is this

US and Canada, Passenger and Immigration Lists Index 1500-1900's
James Fitzpatrick b. abt 1874, arrival year 1884, age 10
Shearon Jim "Home Children Research Continues 'Home Children' Passenger List for the
year 1884" In Anglo Celtic Roots (British Family History Society of Greater Ottawa)
vol. 3:4 (Fall 1997), pp 12, 22-26, page 26.

You can see the passenger list that Rosie and Ambly found here, he is on page 4.
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01eym/

Cheers,
DB