Author Topic: Born in Braan, Urray, R&C  (Read 5553 times)

Offline Rena

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 3,479
  • Crown Copyright: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Born in Braan, Urray, R&C
« Reply #18 on: Sunday 30 August 15 10:50 BST (UK) »
Obviously Free Kirk folk Rena, the church turned out its own ministers after it left the Church of Scotland, and built Trinity College here on the Woodlands Hill, with the three towers,

http://www.scotcities.com/westend/parkdistrict.htm

Skoosh

Thanks for the link Skoosh.

Yes, they were and very devout Skoosh.  My father's parents trailed them to church three times every Sunday. Then in the evening there would be a family musical gathering in the front room where they'd all play their instruments.  Knowing the house it must have been very crowded with scarcely any room to use their bows and probably two playing the piano  :D
Aberdeen: Findlay-Shirras,McCarthy<br />MidLothian: Mason,Telford,Darling,Cruikshanks,Bennett,Sime, Bell<br />Lanarks:Crum, Brown, MacKenzie,Cameron, Glen, Millar
Ross, Urray:Mackenzie<br />Moray: Findlay; Marshall/Marischell<br />Perthshire: Brown Ferguson<br />Wales: McCarthy, Thomas<br />England: Almond, Askin, Dodson, Harrison, Maw, McCarthy, Munford, Pye, Shearing, Smith, Smythe, Speight, Strike, Wallis/Wallace, Ward, Wells<br />Germany: Flamme,Ehlers, Bielstein, Germer, Mohlm, Reupke

RootsChat is the busiest, largest free family history forum site in the country. It is completely free to use. Register now.
Also register instantly with Facebook or Twitter (and other social networks). Start your genealogy search now.


Offline Agneshill

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 83
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Born in Braan, Urray, R&C
« Reply #19 on: Sunday 30 August 15 10:54 BST (UK) »
Rena,

Not wishing to stoke up what may be mis-directing information, but as the previous poster has mentioned there was a smithy on Brahan Estate, here's my Listed Building information and photo when I did my rounds in 1984.

Most estates and large farms had their own blacksmithing facilities, so your man (and my fellow clansman) could have worked elsewhere in Urray Parish and not necessarily at Brahan, where, at the moment, we are enjoying some nice sunshine and a warm breeze!



MacKenzie
MacLeod
Mathesons in U.S.
MacLeay

RootsChat is the busiest, largest free family history forum site in the country. It is completely free to use. Register now.
Also register instantly with Facebook or Twitter (and other social networks). Start your genealogy search now.


Offline Rena

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 3,479
  • Crown Copyright: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Born in Braan, Urray, R&C
« Reply #20 on: Sunday 30 August 15 11:01 BST (UK) »
There's mention of a smithy here:

http://www.britishlistedbuildings.co.uk/sc-14026-brahan-mains-square-urray

Imber

Thanks for the link Imber.

The building looks very interesting, I then followed the trail and found the Brahan map.  Having seen the area marked "Seaforth" I tried to use google earth to see what it consisted of but was unsuccessful.

I'm now leaning towards John being Donald's father, but there's an Alexander in the mix so have to do some more eye strain.  Of course, one of Donald's children could have been named after a benefactor, or a relative who didn't have a son to carry on the name, so I can't rule any of those two possibilities out.   e.g. Donald's daughter Jane named one of her sons Allan, the person attending the birth was the wife/widow of Allan M'kenzie
Aberdeen: Findlay-Shirras,McCarthy<br />MidLothian: Mason,Telford,Darling,Cruikshanks,Bennett,Sime, Bell<br />Lanarks:Crum, Brown, MacKenzie,Cameron, Glen, Millar
Ross, Urray:Mackenzie<br />Moray: Findlay; Marshall/Marischell<br />Perthshire: Brown Ferguson<br />Wales: McCarthy, Thomas<br />England: Almond, Askin, Dodson, Harrison, Maw, McCarthy, Munford, Pye, Shearing, Smith, Smythe, Speight, Strike, Wallis/Wallace, Ward, Wells<br />Germany: Flamme,Ehlers, Bielstein, Germer, Mohlm, Reupke

Offline Agneshill

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 83
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Born in Braan, Urray, R&C
« Reply #21 on: Sunday 30 August 15 11:16 BST (UK) »
Hopefully, this will ease the eye strain!



MacKenzie
MacLeod
Mathesons in U.S.
MacLeay

Offline Flattybasher9

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 3,140
  • Manners cost nothing, and are worth the effort.
    • View Profile
Re: Born in Braan, Urray, R&C
« Reply #22 on: Sunday 30 August 15 11:21 BST (UK) »

Offline Rena

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 3,479
  • Crown Copyright: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Born in Braan, Urray, R&C
« Reply #23 on: Sunday 30 August 15 12:07 BST (UK) »
Hello Agneshlll,

Many thanks for responding to my thread.  All input is most welcome.

As with most family historians I have the quandary of finding the origins of an 80 year old man in the 1851 Old Monkland, Lanarkshire census who states he was born in Urray. (the 1841 census didn't record his birthplace)  The quandary being there's no marriage record anywhere for him and his wife, Ann M'kenzie, dau of Donald McK and Janet Cameron (all four people noted on a grave headstone in Tollcross Cemetery, Old Monkland, Airdrie/Coatbridge and according to archivists this headstone does not exist lol

Luckily the Urray ancestor Donald M'Kenzie had offspring living with him in the 1841 census otherwise my research would have been more difficult because their Old Monkland's baptism records haven't survived either.

I have seen on the Urray baptism records and on freecen website that there were other Donald M'kenzies born around the same time as my Donald.  However, whereas my Donald had sons living with him in 1841 there was no similar indication on the other census that I found.

In desperation I once asked a psychic the origins of my father family.

Immediately she said, "I have a large man here who's laughing and dropping a trail of crumbs on the ground". 
I admitted that I had been following my father's "Crum" family but I was asking for information on his grandmother.

"Oh I can tell you that" she responded "They're from the land of the old monks".

She must have been reading my mind because I already knew she was born in Old Monkland.

She went on to say "I can see a family who have four farms" and she poked the air as though marking four corners.

"There's a connection to Cumberland". (Duke of Cumberland?)
Then she said; "I can see a signpost pointing the way saying "Killing"
She then described walking down a hill with an old quarry on one side, until she eventually came to a little white church.
--

All very vague, no names, etc. and I am none the wiser.

Was "killing" referring to the Jacobites, Duke of Cumberland at Culloden?
Or, because of mention of a church, was she describing a walk to church at some place named Killin/Killen?

Thanks once again.

Rena.  (My mother refused to name me after my father's mother Agnes but agreed to give me the same name that my father's oldest sister Jeanie had given her daughter.  I asked my older cousin up in Aberdeen why her late mother gave her the name Rena.  Apparently "because she liked it", which is what my mother told me.  Roll forward several decades and I discovered from an old census that when my aunt Jeanie was a child in Glasgow there was a little playmate living a few doors away called Rena who had an Italian mother .. Italian "Reina"  as in the ship "Reina Del Mar" (Queen of the sea) lol
Aberdeen: Findlay-Shirras,McCarthy<br />MidLothian: Mason,Telford,Darling,Cruikshanks,Bennett,Sime, Bell<br />Lanarks:Crum, Brown, MacKenzie,Cameron, Glen, Millar
Ross, Urray:Mackenzie<br />Moray: Findlay; Marshall/Marischell<br />Perthshire: Brown Ferguson<br />Wales: McCarthy, Thomas<br />England: Almond, Askin, Dodson, Harrison, Maw, McCarthy, Munford, Pye, Shearing, Smith, Smythe, Speight, Strike, Wallis/Wallace, Ward, Wells<br />Germany: Flamme,Ehlers, Bielstein, Germer, Mohlm, Reupke

Offline Rena

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 3,479
  • Crown Copyright: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Born in Braan, Urray, R&C
« Reply #24 on: Sunday 30 August 15 12:10 BST (UK) »
Aberdeen: Findlay-Shirras,McCarthy<br />MidLothian: Mason,Telford,Darling,Cruikshanks,Bennett,Sime, Bell<br />Lanarks:Crum, Brown, MacKenzie,Cameron, Glen, Millar
Ross, Urray:Mackenzie<br />Moray: Findlay; Marshall/Marischell<br />Perthshire: Brown Ferguson<br />Wales: McCarthy, Thomas<br />England: Almond, Askin, Dodson, Harrison, Maw, McCarthy, Munford, Pye, Shearing, Smith, Smythe, Speight, Strike, Wallis/Wallace, Ward, Wells<br />Germany: Flamme,Ehlers, Bielstein, Germer, Mohlm, Reupke

Offline Rena

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 3,479
  • Crown Copyright: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Born in Braan, Urray, R&C
« Reply #25 on: Sunday 30 August 15 12:27 BST (UK) »
Ah, that's better Agneshill - thank you.

Yes I agree that most large estates in those days were self sufficient.  My English mother has Yorkshire ancestry working on a landed gentry estate and in her Norfolk ancestry, she has a shepherd but what tickled me was the shepherd's son worked as an ostler on the estate so he must have had a full time job looking after the owner's horses, possibly all types of farm work, carriage and riding horses?
Aberdeen: Findlay-Shirras,McCarthy<br />MidLothian: Mason,Telford,Darling,Cruikshanks,Bennett,Sime, Bell<br />Lanarks:Crum, Brown, MacKenzie,Cameron, Glen, Millar
Ross, Urray:Mackenzie<br />Moray: Findlay; Marshall/Marischell<br />Perthshire: Brown Ferguson<br />Wales: McCarthy, Thomas<br />England: Almond, Askin, Dodson, Harrison, Maw, McCarthy, Munford, Pye, Shearing, Smith, Smythe, Speight, Strike, Wallis/Wallace, Ward, Wells<br />Germany: Flamme,Ehlers, Bielstein, Germer, Mohlm, Reupke

Offline Skoosh

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 4,594
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Born in Braan, Urray, R&C
« Reply #26 on: Sunday 30 August 15 13:00 BST (UK) »
Rena,  the name Killin rings a bell anent Mid-Ross. Mackenzie of Fairburn lost his estate for joining the '45, he said that his ancestor was given the land by James IV and he felt obliged to support his descendant. Mackenzie of Kintail, who gets his Seaforth earldom from a sea-loch in Lewis, kept out of the '45 although they had been out in the '15 & '19, and retained Brahan.

I assume from your consulting a spae-wife that you're also familiar with the prophesies of Coinneach Odhar Mackenzie, the Brahan Seer, who foretold, amongst many other things, the fall of Fairburn and that a cow would calve in Fairburn Tower. Something that came to pass many years later.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brahan_Seer

Found a reference to Mackenzie of Killin, it's just east of Garve, at the head of Loch Garve!  ;D

Skoosh.