Author Topic: Johann (John) Schober  (Read 2197 times)

Offline Kojo

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 19
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Johann (John) Schober
« on: Saturday 07 November 15 08:56 GMT (UK) »
I am looking for my grandmothers first husband. Annette Mason married John Schober, a waiter from Austria, in 1909 in London. They had a son Jack. By 1911 census they seemed to be living apart in London. In 1914 he was listed on Annette's third son's birth record as a soldier previously waiter. He was never heard of again.

Offline MaxD

  • Deceased Rest In Peace
  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • ********
  • Posts: 8,056
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Johann (John) Schober
« Reply #1 on: Saturday 07 November 15 10:22 GMT (UK) »
There is a death registered (FreeBMD) for a Johann Schober aged 28 in Stafford Q4 1918 - does the age add up with that on the 1911?

maxD
I am Zoe Northeast, granddaughter of Maximilian Double.
 
It is with great difficulty I share with you that in the early hours of 07 August 2021, Maximilian passed away unexpectedly but peacefully.

With deep sadness,
Zoe



Double  Essex/Suffolk
Randle/Millington Warwicks
Sokser/Klingler Austria/Croatia

Offline philipsearching

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 4,073
  • I was a beautiful baby - what went wrong?
    • View Profile
Re: Johann (John) Schober
« Reply #2 on: Saturday 07 November 15 13:32 GMT (UK) »
There is a death registered (FreeBMD) for a Johann Schober aged 28 in Stafford Q4 1918 - does the age add up with that on the 1911?

maxD

This could be Johann Schober d 12 Dec 1918, buried in Cannock Chase war cemetery. (CWGC has him as an ersatz reservist of the German army).

A free search of the 1911 census shows two John Schobers in London - one is in Paddington aged 23, the other is in Islington aged 31, both from Austria.
Please help me to help you by citing sources for information.

Census information is Crown Copyright http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline MaxD

  • Deceased Rest In Peace
  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • ********
  • Posts: 8,056
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Johann (John) Schober
« Reply #3 on: Saturday 07 November 15 14:48 GMT (UK) »
Looks like three of them?  Two in London, one of whom presumably Annette's husband, and a third somewhat older one born 9 May 1871 who comes up in the Bavarian Infantry records with service dates ending in 1916 - perhaps taken prisoner and died in England?  There was a POW camp at Cannock Chase.

maxD


I am Zoe Northeast, granddaughter of Maximilian Double.
 
It is with great difficulty I share with you that in the early hours of 07 August 2021, Maximilian passed away unexpectedly but peacefully.

With deep sadness,
Zoe



Double  Essex/Suffolk
Randle/Millington Warwicks
Sokser/Klingler Austria/Croatia


Offline MaxD

  • Deceased Rest In Peace
  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • ********
  • Posts: 8,056
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Johann (John) Schober
« Reply #4 on: Saturday 07 November 15 20:46 GMT (UK) »
Kojo - the Paddington man says he is single but that may be an error or deliberate, would you agree that he is the likely husband of Annette and, as you say, living apart that year.?  Given his occupation as a hotel waiter, he was most likely living in at his place of work (The Hotel Westbourne).  My grandparents lived most of their early married life apart as they were both in (different) service.

Are you able to track Annette and the 3 children after 1914?

maxD
I am Zoe Northeast, granddaughter of Maximilian Double.
 
It is with great difficulty I share with you that in the early hours of 07 August 2021, Maximilian passed away unexpectedly but peacefully.

With deep sadness,
Zoe



Double  Essex/Suffolk
Randle/Millington Warwicks
Sokser/Klingler Austria/Croatia

Online Mabel Bagshawe

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 6,781
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Johann (John) Schober
« Reply #5 on: Saturday 07 November 15 21:34 GMT (UK) »
Don;t think the Islington one in 1911 is the one we want - he has a wife with him

Offline MaxD

  • Deceased Rest In Peace
  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • ********
  • Posts: 8,056
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Johann (John) Schober
« Reply #6 on: Saturday 07 November 15 22:20 GMT (UK) »
Agree, hence my focus on the Paddington one. Need a bit more from Kojo on post-1914.
I am Zoe Northeast, granddaughter of Maximilian Double.
 
It is with great difficulty I share with you that in the early hours of 07 August 2021, Maximilian passed away unexpectedly but peacefully.

With deep sadness,
Zoe



Double  Essex/Suffolk
Randle/Millington Warwicks
Sokser/Klingler Austria/Croatia

Offline Kojo

  • RootsChat Extra
  • **
  • Posts: 19
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Johann (John) Schober
« Reply #7 on: Sunday 08 November 15 01:00 GMT (UK) »
Thanks so much for the responses. I am new to the site and was unsure how much info was needed. John's age was 21 on marriage certificate in 1909 which would make him born around 1888. On this certificate his father was listed as Joseph, deceased and a draper. The death in Cannock Chase could have been him but would he have been in the German army or only the Austrian? On emailing Vienna to obtain births around this year I was given only 2 which seems very few and none with a father Joseph. Would there be info from the German army records to show place of birth and parents of the John who died in 1918? Thanks again.

Offline MaxD

  • Deceased Rest In Peace
  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • ********
  • Posts: 8,056
  • Census information Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk
    • View Profile
Re: Johann (John) Schober
« Reply #8 on: Sunday 08 November 15 10:43 GMT (UK) »
The Commonwealth War Graves Commission site doesn't give the date of birth of the Johann Schober buried there.  However, it describes him as a reservist (Ersatz in this context in German) in the German Army (best equivalent would be Territorials).  The Bavarian records, which are for reserve infantry units, have father Josef and his birth place was Unterleiterbach in Bavaria. (There is still a Gasthaus Schober in Unterleiterbach).  He was fighting in Flanders between 1914 and 1916 when he was declared missing.  His date of birth was 9 May 1871.  On the balance of probabilities I would say that the Cannock Chase man is the Bavarian.  (see below)

You still haven't got a death or other sign for your Johann though.  Do you have anything on Annnette's whereabouts after 1914 when child three was born, that might help.

Later edit.  Looking again at the Stafford death in 1918.  The age of the GRO registered death is 28 which accords well with your Johann's age but not with the Bavarian.  I would suggest sending for the death cert to check this out definitively.
I am Zoe Northeast, granddaughter of Maximilian Double.
 
It is with great difficulty I share with you that in the early hours of 07 August 2021, Maximilian passed away unexpectedly but peacefully.

With deep sadness,
Zoe



Double  Essex/Suffolk
Randle/Millington Warwicks
Sokser/Klingler Austria/Croatia