1939 register - search tips discussion

[Mean_genie]

There are some very good search tips here, in addition to the ones on FindMyPast's own site, and it's always useful to share knowledge, but there are limits. I'm surprised no-one has mentioned this yet, but the tips that involve altering the URL are in breach of the Terms and Conditions, and amount to theft of data. 

[ReadyDale]

There are some very good search tips here, in addition to the ones on FindMyPast's own site, and it's always useful to share knowledge, but there are limits. I'm surprised no-one has mentioned this yet, but the tips that involve altering the URL are in breach of the Terms and Conditions, and amount to theft of data.

Would be interested to know which part of the Ts&Cs you think tweaking the URL breaches?

[Mean_genie]

What you are not allowed to do...
· modify, translate, reverse engineer, decompile or disassemble the Site or parts of the Site or create derivative works from the Site;

This also happened with the 1901 Census, when someone found a way of getting data free that they would otherwise have had to pay for by manipulating the URLs on the results pages. It was pointed out at the time.

[ReadyDale]

Firstly, from a technical point of view, I think they would be hard-pressed to convince anyone that the URL which is freely available in the address bar of your browswer constitutes part of the site itself.
But more importantly, the tips regarding tweaking the URL (certainly those that have been reported here) in no way enable anyone to gain access to ANY information that is behind the pay wall. You are achieving nothing more than speeding up what the existing search facility enables you to do anyway.
Specifically, the existing search facility enables you to enter the Reference and returns a list of all those people on that item, which you can then click through individually. By tweaking the last section (fourth) of the URL you get to exactly the same point, just quicker. No further. No extra info.
Exactly the same, if you tweak the third part of that reference, you can move up and down the street, item to item. An effect that is exactly comparable to entering that new reference in the search engine. Again no further. No more info. nothing.
If anything, this helps people find those "harder to find" people, and may well actually encourage people to purchase data.

[Alan b]

This also happened with the 1901 Census, when someone found a way of getting data free that they would otherwise have had to pay for by manipulating the URLs on the results pages. It was pointed out at the time.

I don't know about the 1901 census but you are not getting free data in the way that your think as you are still blocked as all you are seeing is the limited free data Find My Past allows you to see, changing the URL simply allows you to move on from one household member to the next but still only seeing the limited free data. You can still find this yourself by using their search facility but I think you have got the wrong end of the stick with this.

[Mean_genie]

I wonder what the response would be if someone cares to email FindMyPast and say 'Look, this is what we have found we can do to get free information from your site. We're so pleased that we have told all our friends so no-one has to spend any money on it. That's absolutely fine with you, isn't it?'. I am happy to be corrected if I'm wrong, but I very much doubt that the answer will be 'Yes of course, carry on'.

Findmypast is a business, not a charity. If you don't like the way they work, or if you think they are overcharging, fine. Don't use their products, and they won't get your money. That's how the market works.  But if lots of people are going in and extracting large amounts of data without paying, using the enhanced features they spent money developing, they may not be too keen on continuing to invest in other major projects in future. There are huge up front costs involved in major projects like this - only the 1911 census was comparable in scale. Eventually the 1911 census was incorporated into FindMyPast subscriptions, and I have no doubt that the 1939 Register will be too, but the more people get information without paying, the longer the rest of us have to wait.

[BumbleB]

I wonder what the response would be if someone cares to email FindMyPast and say 'Look, this is what we have found we can do to get free information from your site. We're so pleased that we have told all our friends so no-one has to spend any money on it. That's absolutely fine with you, isn't it?'. I am happy to be corrected if I'm wrong, but I very much doubt that the answer will be 'Yes of course, carry on'.

Findmypast is a business, not a charity. If you don't like the way they work, or if you think they are overcharging, fine. Don't use their products, and they won't get your money. That's how the market works.  But if lots of people are going in and extracting large amounts of data without paying, using the enhanced features they spent money developing, they may not be too keen on continuing to invest in other major projects in future. There are huge up front costs involved in major projects like this - only the 1911 census was comparable in scale. Eventually the 1911 census was incorporated into FindMyPast subscriptions, and I have no doubt that the 1939 Register will be too, but the more people get information without paying, the longer the rest of us have to wait.

Quite true, and I agree.  I've got subscriptions to FindMyPast and Ancestry, and I don't begrudge paying for that privilege.  However, there will always be those who "want everything for nothing" and the longer that Ancestry and FindMyPast give away "free weekends" etc.  then the longer this anomaly will continue.  AND by the way, I am a pensioner!!!!

On the down-side, I'm almost getting to the stage where I'm re-thinking helping others to obtain their information from the sources that I have access to, because I'm beginning to feel that I'm being "taken for a ride".    Very sad!

[Rogier]

On the down-side, I'm almost getting to the stage where I'm re-thinking helping others to obtain their information from the sources that I have access to, because I'm beginning to feel that I'm being "taken for a ride".    Very sad!

I'm sorry you feel this way.  The cost of looking up one family is the same that some of us budget to eat and heat our homes for a few days.  Are grateful to public libraries for a place not only to research, but keep warm.

[Ruskie]

If FindMyPast or any other subscription site do not ensure that access to their data sets is functioning as they wish, and if they do not undertake sufficient testing which would/should have found any loopholes which allows people to find "work arounds" and access to information they do not want us to access without paying, then I think that is FindMyPast's fault entirely. You can't blame people for trying - and some of the suggestions show great resourcefulness.

It seems, through reading various threads about the new 1939 register, that there are errors, so perhaps in their haste to release this by a given time, and not sufficiently testing, this has come round to bite them.

I haven't noticed anyone requesting lookups from the 1939 register as everyone knows it is pay to view each record. Similar with Scotland's People - it is rare for anyone to request a look up as it is a credit based system.