Author Topic: JOHN NICOL perth help finding parents  (Read 12819 times)

Offline AncesStory

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Re: JOHN NICOL perth help finding parents
« Reply #54 on: Wednesday 20 April 16 16:31 BST (UK) »
I don't know of any of Johns siblings for sure though.

Molly

Why don't you search SP and purchase the death record for Robert Nicol who died at York Place, Perth in 1865?

It will cost you 6 credits.

His parents should be noted on the death record, since he died post 1855. If his parents are William Nicol and Magdaline Moncrieff, then you will know that following the marriage of William Nicol from Dron and Magdaline Moncrieff from Forteviot and the birth of two sons, James, then John Nicol, they moved to Arngask and had several other children.

Until you can verify or discount the parentage of any of the children born to William Nicol in Arngask ( please see earlier posts in which they are all named) then you will never know for certain whether there is a definite possibility of William Nicol and Magdaline Moncrieff being the parents of John Nicol, the grocer who died in Perth in 1849.

DUFFUS of Edinburgh, Scotland/Murray/Coulter/Anderson/Cauvin/McGillivray/Carstairs
FALLEN, /Dunbartonshire & Partick /Cherry/Main/Gallacher
SCOTT of Gladsmuir/Pencaitland East Lothian
STEVEN of  Caithness, Edinburgh, Scotland/Campbell/Calder/McManus/Waugh/Hoy/Cadzian
McKENZIE of Glenisla, Forfarshire/Farquharson/Robertson/Jack/McNicol/Tosh

Offline Mollyrobz

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Re: JOHN NICOL perth help finding parents
« Reply #55 on: Thursday 21 April 16 09:44 BST (UK) »
Hello everybody,

Firstly, thank you for taking the time to do that Buckhyne, that was such a kind thing to do for somebody :)

Secondly, I've purchased ROBERT NICOLS death cert for 1865 PERTH, 10 YORK PLACE and it says that he was the son of WILLIAM NICOL and MAGDALINE MONCRIEFF

Molly

Offline AncesStory

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Re: JOHN NICOL perth help finding parents
« Reply #56 on: Thursday 21 April 16 14:55 BST (UK) »
Excellent! With Robert Nicol's birth certificate you have proven that William Nicol and Magdalen Moncrieff  moved to Arngask following the birth of two sons in Dron - James, then John.  It seems most probable that John Nicol, grocer from Perth who married Ann McDonald, was  this couple's  second child born in Dron, Perthshire, You may be able to find out a bit more about Magdalen, given that her Moncrieff family is so well researched. Well done!

DUFFUS of Edinburgh, Scotland/Murray/Coulter/Anderson/Cauvin/McGillivray/Carstairs
FALLEN, /Dunbartonshire & Partick /Cherry/Main/Gallacher
SCOTT of Gladsmuir/Pencaitland East Lothian
STEVEN of  Caithness, Edinburgh, Scotland/Campbell/Calder/McManus/Waugh/Hoy/Cadzian
McKENZIE of Glenisla, Forfarshire/Farquharson/Robertson/Jack/McNicol/Tosh

Offline Mollyrobz

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Re: JOHN NICOL perth help finding parents
« Reply #57 on: Friday 22 April 16 10:17 BST (UK) »
You really think that that's enough to back them up as being Johns parents? :)

I wasn't aware that Magdalines family had been well researched so that's something I look forward to seeing

Thank you for your help

Molly


Offline Mollyrobz

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Re: JOHN NICOL perth help finding parents
« Reply #58 on: Thursday 28 April 16 19:00 BST (UK) »
Hello AncesStory,

Would you be so kind as to explain the connection of my John Nicol to the Robert Nicol who's birth cert I purchased? I don't quite understand it! :D sorry to be a pain.

Is there anything else that I could possibly to to solidify this connection that you can think of?

Best wishes
Molly

Offline Rosinish

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Re: JOHN NICOL perth help finding parents
« Reply #59 on: Monday 02 May 16 23:25 BST (UK) »
Hi Molly,

Today I was searching online & came across another topic on here which I was able to contribute to but in the process, I found a cert. in my archives which may belong to your family ???

2 of the names are fascinating to say the least  ;D

MARRIAGE 25 Nov 1887 SCOTLANDWELL, PORTMOAK, KINROSS

DAVID NICOL (Widower) 39 & MARGARET LITSTER 37
Winesses: Dalziel Peebles & Elizabeth Peebles
Usual Residence of David - Drumain, Leslie (Fife)
Usual Residence of Margaret - Kirmeston? (can't make it out), Portmoak
Parents of DAVID - William Nicol & Mary Ballingall (deceased)
Parents of Margaret - Dalziel Litster & Marian Wallace

Had to "Go ogle" that name   :P
http://www.rootschat.com/links/01hk5/

Annie
South Uist, Inverness-shire, Scotland:- Bowie, Campbell, Cumming, Currie

Ireland:- Cullen, Flannigan (Derry), Donahoe/Donaghue (variants) (Cork), McCrate (Tipperary), Mellon, Tol(l)and (Donegal & Tyrone)

Newcastle-on-Tyne/Durham (Northumberland):- Harrison, Jude, Kemp, Lunn, Mellon, Robson, Stirling

Kettering, Northampton:- MacKinnon

Canada:- Callaghan, Cumming, MacPhee

"OLD GENEALOGISTS NEVER DIE - THEY JUST LOSE THEIR CENSUS"

Offline AncesStory

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Re: JOHN NICOL perth help finding parents
« Reply #60 on: Tuesday 03 May 16 16:21 BST (UK) »


Would you be so kind as to explain the connection of my John Nicol to the Robert Nicol who's birth cert I purchased?Molly
Hello Molly - since John's parents are not named on his death certificate of 1849, you will never know for sure whether he is the John Nicol born in Dron, Perthshire. You could research all other possible John Nicol births within a 10 year birth estimate of the 1841 census return and  death certificate for your John Nicol, then try to discount them if possible.
Since several other Nicol children from the Nicol/Moncrieff union lived and worked in Perth at the same time as your John Nicol, it is more probable that they were related:

For instance, according to the  1837-38 Perth Directory your John Nicol, grocer, had a shop at  178 South St Perth, house, 176 South St Perth. Another grocer named "John" Nicol (actually James Nicol as per 1845 Perth directory ) lived in close proximity at 133 South St, Perth, his shop being at 129 Street Perth. He is still at the same address, with the same occupation in 1845. Coincidence? Perhaps. More likely this  grocer James Nicol was John's older brother James, born in Dron, 1785.

Robert Nicol, who you have  proved  to be a son of William Nicol and Magdalen Moncreiff. is named as a general merchant living in Perth at 126 High Street in the 1841 census, and a shipmaster according to the Perth 1845 directory. Two years after your John Nicol's death, Robert was a shipowner living at York Place, Perth. According to this same  census of 1851,  Charles Macdonald Nicol, son of Ann Macdonald and your John Nicol, is mentioned in a Perth directory as being a seaman, at 246 High Street Perth. Coincidence? Perhaps.

David Nicol, born 1798 at  Arngask to William Nicol and Magdalen Moncrieff also lived and worked in Perth.  1845 Perth directory shows him as a vintner, at 14 Meal Vennel, Perth.
1851 census – vintner at 14 Meal Vennel, Perth. Age 53 b 1798 Kinross, Fife.(ie Arngask)
Death record (Perth Burgh burials) Death Date:21 Apr 1854 Burial Date:25 Apr 1854 David Nicol age 56y,occupation: Grocer, Address: Meal Vennel. Cause of death: Apoplexy.

As yet there is no definitive proof that your John Nicol, grocer and merchant,  was the sibling of merchants James, Robert and David Nicol who all  lived and worked in Perth at the same time as John, but I think it is probable.










DUFFUS of Edinburgh, Scotland/Murray/Coulter/Anderson/Cauvin/McGillivray/Carstairs
FALLEN, /Dunbartonshire & Partick /Cherry/Main/Gallacher
SCOTT of Gladsmuir/Pencaitland East Lothian
STEVEN of  Caithness, Edinburgh, Scotland/Campbell/Calder/McManus/Waugh/Hoy/Cadzian
McKENZIE of Glenisla, Forfarshire/Farquharson/Robertson/Jack/McNicol/Tosh

Offline Mollyrobz

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Re: JOHN NICOL perth help finding parents
« Reply #61 on: Thursday 12 May 16 19:55 BST (UK) »
Hello and thank you both for your replies, sorry about my delayed one but I've been really busy as of late :)

Annie that info is most interesting as I've never been able to find any more of William Nicol and Mary Ballingalls children!

I saw the 1891 census which has David Nicol b Arwell, Kinross shire with
Wife Margaret
And children
William Nicol
Elizabeth Maria Nicol
Melville Litster Nicol

Molly

Offline Rosinish

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Re: JOHN NICOL perth help finding parents
« Reply #62 on: Thursday 12 May 16 23:04 BST (UK) »
I saw the 1891 census which has David Nicol b Arwell, Kinross shire with

Molly,

I think the place name was possibly Orwell?

Annie
South Uist, Inverness-shire, Scotland:- Bowie, Campbell, Cumming, Currie

Ireland:- Cullen, Flannigan (Derry), Donahoe/Donaghue (variants) (Cork), McCrate (Tipperary), Mellon, Tol(l)and (Donegal & Tyrone)

Newcastle-on-Tyne/Durham (Northumberland):- Harrison, Jude, Kemp, Lunn, Mellon, Robson, Stirling

Kettering, Northampton:- MacKinnon

Canada:- Callaghan, Cumming, MacPhee

"OLD GENEALOGISTS NEVER DIE - THEY JUST LOSE THEIR CENSUS"