Thomas Cowlishaw Adams 1884 Derby-1918 Aden

[lizdb]

I think I'm going to have to get the marriage Certificate      for Thomas Cowlishaw Adams and Elizabeth Ann Ford..which will give the mother's maiden name..and the father's occupation.
I think the Birth Certificate will only give the "Henry and Sarah Adams..and no dates other than the Birth and the Registration

His marriage cert wont give his mothers maiden name (if we are talking England or Wales). 
His Birth cert should - but you say you already have that. That is why we keep asking you what it says!

[lizdb]

If you haven't actually got his birth cert (I am wondering if maybe it is the online index on Ancestry of Selected Births and Christenings that you have seen, where parents are given as Henry and Sarah - especially as you give year as 1884, which was year of the christening rather than 1883 which was year of his birth) then here are the details you need to order it. Order online from www.gro.gov.uk.

Apr/May/Jun 1883
Burton on Trent
Ref 6b 387
Thomas Cowlishaw Adams

If you haven't got it, then that is definitely your next step.

[spendlove]

Hi Derek,

The two Sarahs are not the same person.

The Sarah who married Henry Adams is not the same Sarah who married Thomas Cowlishaw.

Sarah Adams born 1849 dau of John Adams & Elizabeth/Ann (she uses both in census) and so
sister of Henry Adams, Married August 1871 Thomas Cowlishaw.

Henry Adams & Sarah? commenced having their children in 1874  so all their children were born
after Sarah Adams married Cowlishaw.

We know that in 1901 Thomas Adams, son of Henry & Sarah is living with his Aunt Sarah Cowlishaw
Giving you evidence that Sarah Cowlishaw was indeed the sister of Henry Adams.

In naming 2 of his children with Cowlishaw, is not odd or strange just honoring his sister and borther in law.

Would purchase a birth certificate for one of the children of Henry & Sarah, in order to obtain
Sarah's maiden name. 

Spendlove

[Derbysderek]

Spendlove....an excellently reasoned argument....I had already decided to purchase a Birth Certificate for Thomas Cowlishaw Adams........I'll let you know  Sarah's maiden name as soon as i have it..any bets its HAYNES??...strangely , there is a Haynes mentioned in one of the censuses we have been discussing.....
As ever..thanks and great respect.

Derek.

[spendlove]

Hi Derek,

Thanks - I do like these problems and will give you yet another Sarah:-

We know from 1871 Census Henry Adams, widower, had a daughter listed as Maria Adams.  I think
that she was Christened 21st August 1864 Findern as Fanny Maria Adams dau of Henry Adams
and Sarah. 

There is a possible marriage 26th December 1863 Findern:=

Henry Adams = Sarah Whitmore

Also suitable birth:-
Sarah Whitmore christened 8th November 1840 Findern dau of John & Fanny with possible death for her March Q 1870 Burton.  Buried 18th Jan 1870 Barrow upon Trent.
Fanny Maria married 1895 John Dolman.

As per usual certificates or actual church registers required to confirm.

Await to hear maiden name of Henry's 2nd wife Sarah.

Spendlove

[Derbysderek]

Spendlove!! I need you again!!..........and anyone else with an expertise that i seem not to have....

Thomas Cowlishaw Adams..whilst apparently being baptised as such..in 1883....has a Birth Certificate for 27.03.1883  THOMAS COWLISHAW ADAMS.son of Henry Adams.Agricultural labourer..and SARAH ADAMS....late HAYNES....formerly COWLISHAW !!!!!!!.......which to me indicates that her maiden name was Cowlishaw and she previously married a Haynes.....
I have a birth for Sarah Cowlishaw Weston on trent 1844.daughter of George and Ann.and a marriage of Sarah Haynes to Henry Adams in 1873..so we're some way to explaining the Cowlishaw connection.....IF there was a marriage of Sarah Cowlishaw to a HAYNES..which apparently there was not.........any ideas?
By 1891 Sarah Adams is a widow (born Weston trent 1844)..with the three appropriate Adams children.......Is it possible that the actual CORRECT sarah Adams nee Cowlishaw late Haynes..never actually married a thomas Cowlishaw?

[lizdb]

It is looking like it.

Next step, imho, is to get the marriage cert for Sarah Haynes to Mr Adams - to see a) if she was a widow or otherwise and b) who her father was.

[spendlove]

Hi,

Marriage of Henry Adams = Sarah Haynes, so assume she must have previously married a Haynes,
BUT if you look at the transcript on Familysearch for her marriage to Henry Adams there are problems:-

4.11.1873 St.Werburgh Derby
Henry Adams  (Father George Roberts)  Sarah Haynes (Father John HAYES)

From this you would assume she had not been married previously, and where does George Roberts come from! 

Does anyone have access to the actual Parish Registers for St. Werburgh?

After her marriage to Henry Adams, Sarah states she was born Findern Derby however she may not
have been born there just lived there at an early age.

Derek will take a look at this tonight, however we are away from tomorrow for a few days.

Spendlove

[Derbysderek]

Thanks Spendlove.....just as a ponder, let me run this by you.....

The Sarah Adams that married Thomas Cowlishaw was the wrong one..far too early

Sarah Cowlishaw was born 1844 daughter of George and Ann..at Weston on Trent/Findern/Twyford/Stenson depending on Source..they are all the same place..Civil Parish/Ecclesiastical Parish.Reg Sub district.all within BOT Reg...throw in Mickleover for good measure.
Thomas Cowlishaw (who married Sarah Adams) was born 1851..same place same parents..which explains the 1901 census for Thomas Adams aged 18 being his nephew..........HE was!!.... the son of Sarah Adams nee Cowlishaw..the sister of thomas senior......
If you look at the 1871 Census for George Cowlishaw born 1823 and his wife Ann...Sarah has gone servanting..prior to whatever marriage..Haynes or Adams... ..and shows Thomas aged 20.......but right at the bottom is one WILLIAM HAYNES aged 6 Grandson........
This of course means Grandson to the head of Household..George...and surely MUST mean the mother is George's daughter Sarah!!!!!
So I'll follow that one up.............and I/m going to \matlock tomorrow to look at the St.Werbergh Registers..among others!!
Enjoy your few days off!!

Derek.