1905 Death Apparently Not Registered But Probate Granted

[aghadowey]

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1903/05643/4588064.pdf
but for 1903!!
He was on Census, in what townland??

I gave census and will book links in reply #5

No Medical Attendant there when he died, but a Doctor would have to visit and sign a Death Cert.

The local doctor wasn't always the registrar so even if doctor saw the deceased that still doesn't mean death was registered properly.

[maryalex]

Probate can't be granted without a death cert so the inference here is that his details are in the death index but mis-spelt, he is missing from the death index but recorded locally or he died outside of the area you are looking for.

It might be worthwhile applying for a death cert and include the full details of the date of death and last known address, Cahernagry County Mayo, from the probate calendar.

irishgenealogy.ie has only two John Biggins deaths from 1901 to 1911 in all of Ireland.  Both were registered in Ballinrobe but neither is the right one.    A search with just the forename John in Ballinrobe from 1905 to 1907 was fruitless.

Are you suggesting that it is to the local registrar, which used to be in Cong, that I should apply for a death certificate?

[maryalex]

For reference here's 1901 census-
www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Mayo/Neale/Cahernagry_West/1576205
and Will Book-
http://www.willcalendars.nationalarchives.ie/reels/cwa/005014915/005014915_00021.pdf

The registrar would have recorded the death and then returns sent on to Dublin- perhaps has been missed from index. Not sure if a death certificate (in Ireland) would be needed to apply for probate/administration as I've seen quite a few probate notices in Ireland with incorrect dates (sometimes out by a few years).

I realise that the date of death from the Calendar of Wills & Administrations is not necessarily accurate. For another great-grandfather, the Calendar of Wills & Administrations shows 19 May 1898 and the death certificate shows 6 May 1898 - not far out, I suppose.  I have had to amend some dates of death taken from headstones since free death certificates became available.

[maryalex]

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1903/05643/4588064.pdf

but for 1903!!

He was on Census, in what townland??

He was in Cahernagry West, Co. Mayo.  [His stated age of 45 is ridiculous.  He would have been 60 at the very least.]
Regrettably, the 1903 death is not his.

[maryalex]

No Medical Attendant there when he died, but a Doctor would have to visit and sign a Death Cert.

Would a doctor always have had to visit?
I have lots of photocopy death certificates which show in the cause of death column "....Not Certified. No medical attendant".

[groom]

If it's the same as in England, a doctor has to sign the the form confirming the death and the cause. It doesn't mean that he was there at the death.

[maryalex]

Thank you all for the suggestions made but I think I will have give up.  I have phoned the Civil Registration Service in Castlebar to ask if theirs was the address to write to about a death registration which had possibly not been sent to Dublin and/or not indexed.  The helpful woman who replied said that they have the original hand written registers there and that they do not have a death registration in or around 1905 for my John Biggins .  She said that a memory card or letter from the church where his funeral service was conducted may have been accepted for the purpose of the granting of probate.

I can live with not having a death certificate if none ever existed.

[hallmark]

http://www.swilson.info/regdistmap.php?gregdistid=10  shows the 3 Offices for the area, A + B would have books to Register stuff and these were send quarterly to the Main Office for the Registration District in Ballinrobe.

Even today:  Deaths must be registered as soon as possible after the death and no later than 3 months.

Once a Doctor has signed the Death Cert a body can be buried, and BEFORE Death is Registered!!

A Death Cert is a Death Cert, this is then taken, within 3 months, to have it REGISTERED....

[hallmark]

A death within the State can be registered with any Registrar, irrespective of where it occurs. Deaths must be registered as soon as possible after the death and no later than three months from the date of death.

Upon the death of a person following an illness, a registered medical practitioner who attended the deceased during the illness must complete and sign Part 1 of the Death Notification Form, stating to the best of his or her knowledge and belief the cause of death.
The registered medical practitioner must give the Death Notification Form to a relative or civil partner of the deceased, provided a relative or civil partner exists and that the relative or civil partner is capable of acting as a qualified informant.
The relative or civil partner must complete and sign Part 2 of the form, which concerns additional personal details of the deceased. Upon completion of Part 2, the relative or civil partner must give the form to any Registrar of Deaths as soon as possible but no later than three months from the date of death. In order to complete the registration, the relative or civil partner is required to sign the Register of Deaths in the presence of the Registrar.

https://www.welfare.ie/en/Pages/Registering_Death.aspx