Mary Ellen Wilson, born Kirkdale, Liverpool Nov. 1872

[Doddie]

I am hoping that somebody also has 'my' Mary Ellen Wilson in their family tree. I am investigating some new avenues in order to try and  discover more about the demise of my g.g. grandfather Robert Wilson, Mary's father (the link below is one of my previous postings about Robert which will provide some background detail). Mary's mother was Mary Jane Dickinson. Mary's parents were married in the Edge Hill area of Liverpool in 1866. Mary was born in Kirkdale in November of 1872. In August of 1891 she married Samuel Flynn in Leigh Lancashire. In 1901 Mary and Samuel are living at 11 Birch Street(?), in the Lancashire parish of Tyldesley with Shakerley. Their children are Mary, John and Dorise (or possibly Doris). By 1911 the family are living at 2 Mort(?) Street. They have another child, Samuel. In each census entry Mary's middle initial is incorrectly given as 'H', maybe because the middle name has been heard as 'Helen'.

I would be very grateful to anyone who can shed new light on what became of Mary's father. I am hoping that any relative of Mary's who comes across this post might be able to provide some new insights.

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=421529.msg2866940#msg2866940


Regards

Doddie

[lizdb]

So it is the father Robert you are looking for the death for?  Heading and narrative are about Mary though?  You haven't said when / where Robert was last heard of , however -

Seems to be alive and kicking up to at least 1911.

And in Yorkshire.

Born 1851 ish to aid searching for death

Here is the 1901
Westmorland Villa , Norton, MAlton, YOrks
Robert Wilson 50 retired timber merchant bn Kendal Westmorland
Mary 50 bn Riston Richard?
Lily Curwen 16 dtr bn Liverpool
Daisy Colman 11 dtr bn Liverpool
Albert Henry Nicholls 11 grandson bn Liverpool

[lizdb]

Have you ruled out this death?

Oct/Nov/Dec 1914
Malton
Ref 9d 503
Robert Wilson
age 64

[Doddie]

Hi lizdb, please forgive the unintentional confusion. The reason I have used Mary in the heading is that I am hoping it may catch afresh someone's eye where as Robert's name has not thus far revealed anything definite about his death. My g. grandfather William Wilson was the younger brother of Mary. Up until now I have tried researching the histories of various members of the Wilson family except Mary, for some reason, in order to try and find something concrete about Robert. My hope is that I might be able to obtain fresh information if this time I use Mary as the initial 'hook'.

Robert was born in Seaforth, Liverpool in 1845. His last 'sighting' is as the informant on the death certificate of his wife Mary Jane in 1888. This was in the Haydock area of Lancashire. After that nothing. For most of his working life he was a bricklayer (and for a short time a worker on the railways). I have over the years managed to accumulate a good deal of information about Robert  his family and their movements in the general Lancashire area. I have come back to trying to find him after letting the matter rest for a good while

I hope my using Mary in the heading has not caused too much frustration.

Regards

Doddie

[lizdb]

So - is this the family in 1881?

If so - then it is the same family I found in 1901 and that links in with the death I gave you for Robert.

1881
99 Medock Street Kirkdale Liverpool
Robert Wilson 30 Printer compositor bn Kendall Westmorland
Mary 30 bn Preston Richard?  Westmorland
Mary E 8 bn Manchester
Alfred 3 bn Salford

If this isn't the family, then can you give the details of the right family in 1881?

[Doddie]

Hi again lizdb, Unfortunately that family you found is not 'my' Wilson family. Below are the family entries for the 1871 & 1881 censuses.

1871

Civil Parish:  Walton

Ecc. Parish:  Walton St. Mary

Town:           Bootle

Street:          1 Marsh View

Robert Wilson:  DOB abt 1845, Seaforth, Lancashire. Railway Porter
Mary J. Wilson: DOB abt 1845, Waterloo, Lancashire.
Elizabeth Wilson: DOB abt 1870, St. Helens, Lancashire
Johnson Maguire: Boarder

1881

Civil Parish:  Newton-in-Makerfield

County:        Lancashire

Street:         Wargrave 1 Rookery Cottage

James Wilson:  DOB abt 1845, Seaforth, Lancashire. Bricklayer
Mary Jane Wilson:  DOB abt 1845, Waterloo, Lancashire. Dress Maker
Elizabeth M. Wilson:  DOB abt 1870, Sutton, Lancashire. Scholar
Mary H Wilson:  DOB abt 1873, Liverpool, Lancashire. Scholar
James R  Wilson:  DOB abt 1875, Birkdale, Lancashire. Scholar
William Wilson:  DOB abt 1877, Birkdlale, Lancashire.
Cecilia A Wilson:  DOB abt 1880 Newton Le Willows, Lancashire
William J Whitton:  Boarder

I realise it says James Wilson for the 1881 census. During the 15 or so years that I have been researching the my Wilson line Robert has (in various documents) been referred to as Robert Wilson/ Robert James Wilson/James Wilson/James Robert Wilson. I am still utterly mystified as to the origins of the sporadically used name of James. Also Mary is once again given the middle initial 'H' but she is definitely Mary Ellen as this is the middle name that appears on her birth and marriage certificates. I am now convinced that the only way I am going to find out about Robert's fate is from a person with direct links to my Wilson family and who may have some new anecdotal information about Robert's death.

Regards

Doddie

[Doddie]

Just to let you know lizdb, I really appreciate all your input. I do not want you to drive yourself to distraction as a result of me inadvertently drip-feeding additional information. Below is another link on the subject of Robert that I posted on the site at an earlier date. I have had various posts on this subject over the years as I try and approach the problem from a different angle each time.

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=286570.msg5964146#msg5964146

Regards

Doddie

[lizdb]

I see that Cecilia is on 1891 and 1901 censuses with her sister Elizabeth (now married to William Sharratt), and then marries Mr Lythegoe in 1909

How do the girls describe their father on these two marriages?   Is he John or Robert? Do either say "deceased"?

[Doddie]

Here is a breakdown of the forms of name for Robert on various birth/marriage certs for Mary and her other siblings.

Births

Feb. 1870, Elizabeth Moore Wilson: Father, Robert Wilson
Nov. 1872, Mary Ellen Wilson: Father, Robert Wilson
Sep. 1874, James Robert Wilson: Father, Robert Wilson
Jan.  1877, William Wilson (my g. grandfather): Father, Robert Wilson
Apr.  1879: Cecelia Annie Wilson: Father, James Robert Wilson

Marriages

Jun. 1889: Elizabeth Moore Wilson: Father, Robert James Wilson
Aug. 1891: Mary Ellen Wilson: Father, Robert James Wilson (deceased)
Apr. 1899: William Wilson: Father, James Robert Wilson (deceased)
Mar. 1909: Cecelia Annie Wilson: Father, Robert James Wilson (deceased)
Aug. 1918: Elizabeth married for a second time: Father, Robert Wilson (deceased)

Also, on the death certificate of his wife Mary Jane dated Mar. 1888 Robert, as the informant, is noted as R. J. Wilson.