Harris family, Merthyr Tydfil 1851

[MarMnkly]

Hi Deirdre
it's this enforced rest that's doing it; I wont be so glued to the laptop when I'm running about again in a couple of weeks 
The electoral roll for Penydarren shows addresses, for example:
Plantation Street
Jenkins Court, Plantation Street
Cross Street East, Plantation Street
Top Cross Street, Plantation Street
Top of Cross Street, Plantation Street
1st Gully, Plantation Street
Gully, Plantation Street
There are lots of other streets that also seem to locate themselves by linking to another street (Dowlais is the same), so I think they've just left the word 'street' off after Plantation on the death cert. Maybe that was how people said it locally?
One of my favourite Merthyr sites (Alan George Old Merthyr again !) has an image of what  Plantation Street houses looked like - off the road and back to back
http://www.alangeorge.co.uk/penydarrenpage3.htm
I've got the electoral rolls on FindMyPast, but have never really looked properly before (it's this enforced rest again that's given me hours to waste  )
Mar

[Deirdre784]

Mar, I for one am extremely grateful for your efforts and hope it is giving you something to keep you occupied (enforced rest is hard work!). I have FindMyPast but didn't think to look on there for old electoral registers tho' I use the later years! Considering the majority of my lot couldn't read or write I'd be surprised to see many feature.

I'm still in work so may have a complete computer break when I finish tonight, but many, many thanks to you. Hope you are resting as instructed 

[Deirdre784]

Sadly no birth record in Merthyr for Ann, so either her birth wasn't registered or she was born elsewhere (though the records i have for her all say born Merthyr).

[MarMnkly]

Hi Deirdre 
I've been having a further think about the entry for Ann Harris, Sept Q 1846 (Vol 26 page 427) that has  dash in the GRO online index for mothers maiden name.
This date for the entry would fit with the 1851 entry for age 4; would fit with that possible entry in 1861 for an Ann Harris a 'relative' with the old lady Sarah Harries; would fit with being 20 when marrying in September 1866; but is out for her death in 1874 (aged 26).

A search on discussions here on RootsChat about the use of a 'dash' where the entry for the mothers maiden name should be, says:
- either no maiden name (i.e. unmarried)
- maiden name the same as married name (i.e. a Harris marrying a Harris, although the discussion says it would usually still be listed)
- unreadable
- not properly indexed (the advice was to check others indexed on the same page as some people had found a page where many entries had no mothers maiden name)

With this in mind, I went through all the birth  entries for Merthyr (vol 26 page 427), for Q2 and Q3 in 1846 and the entry for Ann Harris is the only one with a dash against the mothers maiden name.

My thoughts.....
*totally unrelated birth;
*mothers maiden name is unreadable and it could be your Ann;
*a birth entry for an unmarried relation (to David shoemaker) and David and his wife have taken the child into their home as their own child. If the latter was the case, then Ann may never had known, and could have named David as her father on her marriage certificate.
*of course this still doesn't help with the inconsistency for the registration of David in 1850 (aged 9 months in 1851 census).
*the cholera epidemic in 1849 was catastrophic for Merthyr, 1,600 deaths of a pop of 40,000+; how many children were taken in by other families due to parental deaths -well mainly the mother as father would need to work to live.

Mar 

[Deirdre784]

Hi Mar, thanks very much for your continued searching, much appreciated.

I too was interested in the '-' entry, and as there is no registration for David either (not that i can see), i wonder if they have both been taken in / adopted by David and Ann. If the 1850 David was theirs, but not Ann, that means a big gap between Sarah in 1844 and David. Unless none of the children are registered and the Elizabeth and Sarah births to a Roberts mother are another family. 

I've found a possible burial for Ann (wife) in 1851, so maybe that death cert would give us a clue. If she had been ill for some years, maybe it would confirm that Ann and David were not her children. While i've not yet located a re-marriage for David to Margaret, their first child was born in 1853 so 1851 looks reasonable, and the Ann Harris burial (at St Tydfil's) was aged 38 (though if born in 1811 she should have been 40). Think another email to Merthyr registration office is in order 

[MarMnkly]

Hi Deirdre
The GRO reference shows the birth of John Harris: 1853  Sept Quarter in Merthyr Volume 11A  Page 272 with a mothers maiden name of Davies.
FreeBMD reference on the same page for marriages (June quarter 1852 -11a 521) of a David Harris and a Margaret Davies along with others, so could be possible if the death of Ann in 1851 is right.
Mar
 

[Deirdre784]

Hi Mar, I saw the 1853 John (mmn Davies) birth but there aren't similar records for Jane (1866, though there is one in 1864) and James (1868, nothing +/- 2 years) from the 1871 census so I wasn't convinced she was Davies. 

[MarMnkly]

Deidre
there is a baptism in Merthyr on 26th July 1846 of Ann, daughter of Ann Harris. Under the 'abode' column I'm convinced it says single woman. Then under the trade or profession column it says Glebeland - probably Glebeland Street in Merthyr town centre. I couldn't find it using a specific search on FindMyPast, so to see it, go to an 'all categories' search; put in Ann Austin, year of birth 1846 (with no parameter on years); Merthyr Tydfil for 'where'. Then hit search.
First hit will be Ann Austin, Glamorgan baptisms; click the image button to bring up the images for pages 236 and 237, then click one page to the right to bring up pages 238 and 239. Look at the last image at the bottom of page 239.

Could this be the same Ann Harris, Sept Q 1846 (Vol 26 page 427) that has  dash in the GRO online index for mothers maiden name.
Mar 

[Deirdre784]

Mar, that's an amazing find, and yes it does look like the Ann Harris (name nor terribly clear, maybe that's why the search doesn't find her) registered in Sep quarter 1846 with a dash for mother's maiden name.

Will have a quick look to see if there are any other family baptisms there (don't think i've found any in glamorgan before).

On leave this week, down in sunny - at the moment - north Devon, but sadly very limited internet access, though working ok now.

Hope you are enjoying your enforced rest, and thanks again for all your help. 🌸🌻🌹