Author Topic: Is Harris my geat-grandfather's real surname?  (Read 8225 times)

Offline crisane

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Re: James or Thomas Harris? Handwriting query
« Reply #36 on: Tuesday 10 October 17 22:43 BST (UK) »
There is no confusion as to what is written on the original image in the 1891 census. The name is James Harris. His wife Emily born Monmouthshire as are  William age 9 and Annie age 6.
If you look at the last family on the page there is a son Thomas Mellor with the h in Thomas very clear (the m looks more like an N though  :)

Offline JenB

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Re: James or Thomas Harris? Handwriting query
« Reply #37 on: Tuesday 10 October 17 22:54 BST (UK) »
However there is some dispute whether the entry is for  a James Harris or a Thomas Harris.

Agree with crisane. The name is James.

I looked at you other thread, and I don't see any dispute, there is general agreement that the name as written on the page is James  :-\
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Offline Tiffany84

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Re: James or Thomas Harris? Handwriting query
« Reply #38 on: Tuesday 10 October 17 23:03 BST (UK) »
 Thanks for the replies ! The two never married I don't think.  However, on both the 1901 and 1911 census which follow he is shown as Thomas.
I can't find any earlier census entries which seem to fit.
There is a James Harris born 1862 in Honiton but I cannot find him shown in 1871 or 1881.
I still wonder why he switches to Thomas on the later census entries?

Offline Dundee

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Re: James or Thomas Harris? Handwriting query
« Reply #39 on: Tuesday 10 October 17 23:31 BST (UK) »
In my opinion it was the enumerator who mistranscribed the information from the original return into his books.  The occupation may have orginally been 'Hewer' not 'Hatter'.

Debra  :)


Offline Tiffany84

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Re: James or Thomas Harris? Handwriting query
« Reply #40 on: Tuesday 10 October 17 23:52 BST (UK) »
Hi Dundee,   Never thought of that.  As I said in a previous post the occupation of Hatter seems out of sync with his employments in other census entries.  I  will plod on with trying to find either a James or a Thomas who I can follow from around 1883 in Honiton to 1891 in Manchester.
Thanks!

Offline JenB

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Re: Is Harris my geat-grandfather's real surname?
« Reply #41 on: Wednesday 11 October 17 08:50 BST (UK) »
New thread re the 1891 census Thomas/James question

Topics now merged
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Offline lizdb

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Re: James or Thomas Harris? Handwriting query
« Reply #42 on: Wednesday 11 October 17 13:32 BST (UK) »
In the same way, if the writing was particularly bad on the original return, then Thomas may well have been read as James and recorded as such on the enumerators schedule.

I wouldn't get too hung up on the 'James' on that one census. Keep an open mind.
Edmonds/Edmunds - mainly Sussex
DeBoo - London
Green - Suffolk
Parker - Sussex
Kemp - Essex
Farrington - Essex
Boniface - West Sussex

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Offline Tiffany84

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Re: James or Thomas Harris? Handwriting query
« Reply #43 on: Wednesday 11 October 17 13:46 BST (UK) »
lizdb
Thanks will do!

Offline Tiffany84

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Is Harris my geat-grandfather's real surname? Am I getting too fanciful?
« Reply #44 on: Thursday 12 October 17 16:21 BST (UK) »
To all who have helped me to date.  I am wondering if I am now getting too fanciful in my efforts to trace my Great-Grandfather who I know as Tom ( Thomas ) Harris. I can only trace him back to the 1891 census in Manchester where the entry reads as James Harris. He gives his name as Thomas on subsequent 1901 and 1911 census documents always place of Birth is given as Honiton around 1864.
My Great Grandmother was Emily Stoneham from Shirenewton in Monmouthshire. Thanks to the help of Rootschat members I have now established that prior to 1891 she had a relationship with Samuel F Waite and that her first 4 children bear the name of Waite. On the 1891 census she is in Stretford Manchester and with James Harris who is shown as a Hatter. Prior to this she has remained in Monmouthshire.  However, the 'James' and the 'Hatter' related to my Great-grandfather may have been errors made when the enumerator transcribed his notes.  This could explain there being an anomaly of name and also the unusual occupation, given that always subsequently in returns my Great-grandfather's occupations are more manual in nature.
In following up leads (so excellently provided) I tried to establish the whereabouts of Samuel F Waite in 1891.  I was trying to work out if Emily left him and travelled to Manchester and quickly met Thomas (James) Harris or if she has travelled with Samuel Waite. I think she was pregnant at the time as the final' child recorded as 'Waite' is born in Manchester.  If I could establish whether my Great-grandfather was at any point resident in Monmouthshire this may give me a pointer but  as yet I cannot trace him prior to 1891.  However, in my various searches I have come across a criminal record for 1891 for a James Harris (also known as Samuel White who is convicted to 4 months in Glamorgan.  Incidentally, Samuel Waite shows his origins as Glamorgan.  On the record of  the day In June 1891 when he is convicted there is also a fellow prisoner named as a Thomas Harris who is acquitted. 
 I can't put all this together in my head but feel there are a lot of coincidences floating around here!  Hence, my saying am I being too fanciful?