James Walker Born Edinburgh 1860

[SandraEve]

Further research. On the 1861 census Piece 3922 105 Page 12 Carlisle there is a Jane Walker Female daughter.  On the 1871 census Piece 5100 19 Page 31 Newcastle Upon Tyne. The family members place of birth correspond on both census and also the ages with the exception of the father William.  It seems obvious that this is the James Walker I am looking for and the error is on the 1861 census. Can I be sure?  As yet I have not traced a birth entry for him having searched Scotland and England births.

[Forfarian]

Further research. On the 1861 census Piece 3922 105 Page 12 Carlisle there is a Jane Walker Female daughter.  On the 1871 census Piece 5100 19 Page 31 Newcastle Upon Tyne. The family members place of birth correspond on both census and also the ages with the exception of the father William.  It seems obvious that this is the James Walker I am looking for and the error is on the 1861 census. Can I be sure?  As yet I have not traced a birth entry for him having searched Scotland and England births.

It's certainly possible. I have come across a couple of errors of that sort, including confusion between James/Jane.

Did you mean to say that the 1871 census shows James and the 1861 shows Jane and all the rest of the family matches?

[Forfarian]

Looking at that census in Carlisle, I see that the parents are William Walker and Mary, and that daughter Sarah, 5, was born in Sunderland and son William, 3, in Scotland.

Looking at births of Sarah Walkers in Sunderland in 1855 plus or minus two years there are eight, and the mothers' surnames are Ryles, Wake, Calvert, Johnston, Laverick, Patterson, Henderson and one with no surname stated, which suggests that she was illegitimate.

Looking in the IGI at FS for births of William Walkers in Scotland 1856-1859, there are eight with father William and mother Mary, and the mothers' surnames are Johnston, Watson, Bennie, Miller, Dargan, Donelly, McIlhaney, and Gray.

The only surname on both lists is Johnston, so I deduce that the parents of this family are William Walker and Mary Johnston.

Re-running the search in Scotland using parents William Walker and Mary Johnston produces a very curious result: two sons, James and Joseph, both born in Dumfries on 3 January 1860. The reason this is curious is that they are only in the (unreliable) community contributed section of the IGI, and not in the (normally reliable) community indexed section.

However they do occur on Scotland's People, both registered in Dumfries in 1860, with consecutive numbers, so they were definitely twins. Presumably Joseph died young, but if so, it wasn't in Scotland.

I don't see a marriage of William Walker and Mary Johnston in Scotland, but James' (or Joseph's) birth certificate should tell you when and where they were married. This in turn will tell you whether John, born 1850/1851, was born before or after their marriage.

Does that help?

[SandraEve]

"Did you mean to say that the 1871 census shows James and the 1861 shows Jane and all the rest of the family matches?"

Yes I did mean to say that. Apologies.

"Does this help ?" 

Yes it does, very much so.  I checked the statutory registers Scotlands People births for James and Joseph and indeed as you deduced the parents of James and Joseph are William Walker and Mary Johnston.  I have ordered the birth certificate for James Walker. I am really looking forward to finding out where and when they were married and doing further research on the family.
I cannot thank you enough for your help.  I have spent hours and hours of research and came nowhere near close to the information you found in researching.  Makes me realise what a novice I am. 

[Forfarian]

Oh good, I'm glad it was useful.

It doesn't explain why James thought he was born in Edinburgh or Midlothian, however.

[SandraEve]

No indeed not.  It certainly did not help in my searching.  I concentrated on Midlothian and Edinburgh

[Forfarian]

No indeed not.  It certainly did not help in my searching.  I concentrated on Midlothian and Edinburgh

I presume that you have James' marriage certificate and that it confirms that his father's name was William. What does it say William's occupation was?

[SandraEve]

No I don't have James marriage certificate.  I have ben unable to find a marriage entry.  I have my grandmothers birth certificate and also those of her siblings, all born in Birmingham except Jordie born in Warrington.  The father on all of them is James Walker, iron moulder journeyman and mother Elizabeth Lyndon. I wondered that if James was Catholic and Elizabeth C of E  marriage may have caused problems. I have found no baptism entries for my grandmother or her siblings.  On the 1891 census Aston Manor RG 12/2437 pages 44/45 James is a boarder living with Elizabeth Lyndon and her family.   

[Forfarian]

No I don't have James marriage certificate.  I have ben unable to find a marriage entry.  I have my grandmothers birth certificate and also those of her siblings, all born in Birmingham except Jordie born in Warrington.  The father on all of them is James Walker, iron moulder journeyman and mother Elizabeth Lyndon. I wondered that if James was Catholic and Elizabeth C of E  marriage may have caused problems. I have found no baptism entries for my grandmother or her siblings.  On the 1891 census Aston Manor RG 12/2437 pages 44/45 James is a boarder living with Elizabeth Lyndon and her family.

Silly of me. Of course I read the bit further up the thread, but I'd forgotten that in the middle of last night. Apologies.

I checked the index to RC baptisms and marriages in Scotland and found nothing to indicate that the family was Catholic.