Gwen McDonald of Trefriw

[Ellenmai]

I'm trying to find the family of Gwen McDonald born Trefriw 16/6/1891, GRO states Mother Evans. 0n the 1901 register she was living at Rhenrhiw Ucha Penmachno adopted daughter of Margaret Vaughan. Gwen married David J Jones 1923 registered Llanrwst but could have been Penmachno. On the 1911 Census she was a servant at Penmachno Post Office.
On the 1901 Census I have found a Robert McDonald born 1889 Trefriw living with his Grandmother Margaret Evans at Neaudd Cottage Trefriw. Could this be Gwen's Grandmother & Brother?
I have also found on the 1901 Census Pierce McDonald born 1894 he is in Llanrwst Workhouse. The birth Index shows a Pierce mcDonald Evans born 1894 registered Llanrwst, could this be another sibling?
I would be very grateful for any help or suggestions, thanks.

[CaroleW]

Is there a McDonald /Evans marriage?  If not - you need her birth cert to establish her mothers full name then see if she can be traced on the 1891 census.  As the birth reg gave a mmn which is different to the registered surname - there is a possibility a father is named on the cert

Does Gwen name a father on her 1923 marriage cert?

The birth Index shows a Pierce mcDonald Evans born 1894 registered Llanrwst, could this be another sibling?

On the 1901 Census I have found a Robert McDonald born 1889

Have you used GRO online to establish mmn?

[despair]

I can see  two strands which I can't yet connect.Persons of interest either have no record or no mmn

1.Margaret Evans,who,in 1891,has Robert Macdonald grandson,given born 1889.Strangely,I can't see this birth registered,but it doesn't matter,because:-
I have found a marriage record for Robert in 1913 in which,as well as being a coachman(see James McDonald later),he gives his address as Crafnant House Trefriw,and his father as Hugh McDonald.tailor.
There is a record for Hugh McDonald,Tailor in Trefriw in 1891(RG12/4633/85/7) in which he apppears to be married to a Kate,37 years his junior.Perhaps it is a mistake and she is married to the son Hugh.
I believe this Kate to be Catherine,daughter of Pierce and Margaret(as above) Evans as seen in the 1871 census(RG10/5678/93/18
There is a succession of Pierce Evans in Blaen y Wern Trefriw,but both a Pierce  and a Pierce McDonald Evans appear separately in the 1901 census.

2.There are two McDonald deaths under Llanrwst in the early 1900s- a William Charles and a Donald.
These turnout to be sons of a James McDonald(coachman/groom) and his wife Sarah from Knighton.
In 1891 James is in Tan y Bwlch(Llanrwst) while Sarah is still in Knighton with the family and a 2 year old boarder Annie Frances Evans,who I cannot trace.By 1901 the whole family has moved to Bryntyrch Ucha,Llanrhychwyn,Llanrwst.James dies in 1907.

Roger

[despair]

In the 1881 census Hugh(senior) is given as Hugh Donald McDutton,whereas the son is just McDonald.
This data gives Hugh(senior) married to a Mary,so it's more likely Kate married the son.
Hugh(senior) dies in 1898 as Hugh Donald McDutton.

Roger

[Ellenmai]

Thank you both your help &  the information found, seems you have opened up a complete new picture. Are the McDonald children possibly illegitimate? despair please could you tell me where you found the marriage for Robert McDonald in 1913 as I can't find it, also where was the marriage & who was the bride, her father & address? I had found Robert living at Crafnant House on the 1911 Census so it is the same one.

[despair]

Marriage is on FindMyPast in BMD section.Robert is given as MacDonald not McDonald.Birth 1889,Marriage 1913.It comes out under Dimael,Denbighshire.If you still can't find it I will transcribe important bits

Roger

[despair]

Just for clarity,Donald McDonald mmn Bason,part of the James McDonald family was born in Llanrwst registration area June Quarter 1892,so the whole family had probably moved from Knighton by then.I'm still not sure if they are involved.

Roger

[Mabel Bagshawe]

There's some rather unhappy details of the family circumstances in 1899 here

https://newspapers.library.wales/view/3604332/3604338/70/

[Mabel Bagshawe]

Kate (as Catherine) is also in the workhouse in 1901 under her married name