Henry LLOYD (Glove manufacturer) and Caroline Jane BESSELL

[atworthy]

Hi,

Just wondering if anyone can help me with my 3rd great grandparents, Henry LLOYD the son of John LLOYD and Charlotte Hetty CHIPPS baptised 1798 Westminster and Caroline Jane BESSELL born about 1805/1811 daughter of Charles BESSELL who he married in 1822 Paddington.

I have them both in the 1851 Census (2 Carlton Place, St James) and Caroline with two of their children at the same address in 1841. In 1857 they left England for Geelong, Australia. Henry appears in the electoral rolls from 1839 to 1851 at 2 Carlton Place, but to date can't find him in the 1841 Census.

On Caroline's death certificate her father is listed as Charles and mother's details are unknown. There are family trees online which suggest her parents are Charles BESSELL and Jane MOWBRAY but I have not found this marriage or any other evidence to support this line. Any information that can help me with this line, I would truly appreciate.

If anyone has any suggestions on how I can also find out more about the glove manufacturing business, I would also really appreciate it. His father, John LLOYD was also listed as a glover.

Thanks for reading

[ciderdrinker]

Hello
I don't know what you have so forgive me if I duplicate anything.
Henry Lloyd and Caroline Jane Bessell married at St James Paddington 27.5.1822 bach and spinster by banns.
Both signed and there is no mention of Caroline being under age.
Witnesses William Long and Eliza Lloyd who again  both signed.

The 1851 census gives her birth as 1806 Mill Hill Middlesex.
She was baptised at St Mary Hendon 15 June 1805 d of Charles and Jane Bessell born April (8th?)
Her Victoria death registration in 1878 confirms her father as Charlie.
She is 50 when she and Henry age 58 ,gentleman leave for Australia on the  6 th Oct 1856 with their two children on the Stuart Wartley. This would fit with the baptism.(The transcription is indexed as Catherine Jane LLoyd on Ancestry).
No sign of a marriage for Charles and Jane.

For the children of Henry and Caroline Jane there are the following christenings

Caroline Eliza 5 May /1 June 1823  St James Westminster Carlton St Glover
Charlotte 25 th Mar 1825 born 25 Feb St James Westminster  Carlton St glover
Charles 12 Nov 1826 born 15th ?  same
Emma Mary Ann Feb 26 bapt 24 Aug 1828 same
Julia Leonora born 5 Feb bapt 27 May 1830
Eliza 12 Feb /25 Mar 1832 St James Westminster Carlton St glover
Jane LLoyd  1 Feb 1834/11 May 1834 St James Westminster
Annette born 9 Jan /16 Feb 1836 Carlton st/Regent St glover buried 27 Jan 1837
Henry John 1 Feb 1838 born 23 Dec 1837 buried 15 June 1846
Alfred George LLoyd 3 May 1840/3 June 1840 St James Westminster buried 20 July 1842
Elinor Bessell 27 Oct 1842 bapt 27 Nov 1842 buried 9 Jan 1844
Edith Anne 19 Feb/16 Mar 1845 same
Miriam Eliza 10 Cot 1847/16 Jan 1847

I'll see what else i can find.

Ciderdrinker

[ciderdrinker]

Hi
Possible stuff on Charles Bessell ,the only one I can see in the London area.
Bapt St Martin in the Fields 25.2./11.3.1767 s of John and Frances
Promoted to Tower Hill militia 25.5.1814 Gentleman
burial 27.5.1845 St Luke Chelsa of Peckham Rye Lane born 1767
His PCC Will 1854 leaves everything to wife Rosina who he married in 15.10.1839 at St Mary Woolworth.Unfortunately the details are not online .She was a Miss Southton.
.
There is a Charles George Mowbery Bessell s of George  and Martha nee Jacobs  born c 1820 .Father George was baptised St Margaret Westminster 29 Apr 1797/17 Aug 1797 s of Charles and Jane Bessell.
This would fit as a brother of Caroline Jane.
Other siblings Charles 3 Dec 1793/bapt 26 Mar 1794

Like you I can't see a marriage for Charles and Jane.

Ciderdrinker

[atworthy]

Thank you so much for all that information ciderdrinker.

I had all the details of their children, but I didn't have Ellinor Bessell Lloyd 1842. It now makes me wonder whether the Elinor Frost aged 30 in the 1841 Census living with Caroline at 2 Carlton Street may be a sister to Caroline Jane Bessell??? There was also a George French? aged 9 living with them at the time too.

For those interested, I do have further information on their children, as added below after the **.

It's the Bessell ancestors and siblings I am really struggling with.

Caroline Eliza 5 May /1 June 1823   ** buried 13 March 1831 St Luke Chelsea
Charlotte 25 th Mar 1825 born 25 Feb ** died 5 December 1914 Geelong m William Roberts BATTEN
Charles 12 Nov 1826 born 15th Oct ** Died before 1882
Emma Mary Ann ** 24 July 1828 bapt 21 Aug 1828  buried 26 December 1852 Kensal Green
Julia Leonora born 5 Feb bapt 27 May 1830** buried 23 February 1832 Chelsea
Eliza 12 Feb /25 Mar 1832 St James
Jane LLoyd  1 Feb 1834/11 May 1834  ** died 19th July 1868 m THOMAS BATTEN
Annette born 9 Jan /16 Feb 1836 Carlton st/Regent St glover buried 27 Jan 1837
Henry John 1 Feb 1838 born 27 Dec 1837 ** died 12 Jan 1882 Castlemaine m Janet CORBETT
Alfred George LLoyd ** 7 May 1840/3 June 1840 St James Westminster buried 20 July 1842
Elinor Bessell 27 Oct 1842 bapt 27 Nov 1842 buried 9 Jan 1844
Edith Anne 19 Feb/16 Mar 1845 ** Died 5 May 1916 Victoria m Thomas Brown HILL
Miriam Eliza **10 Dec 1847 bap 16 Jan 1848 died 24 Jan 1934 Geelong. After sister's death married Thomas BATTEN in Adelaide and returmed to Geelong (my ancestors).

[ciderdrinker]

Hello me again
There is a possible marriage for Charles Bessell junior in 13.7.1819 to Frances Edwards at St George the Maytr Camden.
wit Edward Corbett Bessell and Jane Bessell
Edward Corbett Bessell bpt Mitcham 12.3.1800 as Beswell s of Charles.

Ciderdrinker

[atworthy]

Thanks again ciderdrinker. I must have been replying to your first one while you added your next reply.

I'm now curious to find out more about the Tower Hill militia. I have a drawing/photo of someone I was led to believe was Captain Charles Bessell - Caroline's father. Have never been able to verify it though - was just in the family scrapbook unlabeled.

[atworthy]

Well, if the other family trees are right, Charles Bessell and Jane Mowbray had the following children:

George 1797 Westminster
John 1799
Bowen 1802 d 1804 Mitcham, Surrey
Mowbray 1803 Mitcham, Surrey
Caroline Jane 1805 Mill Hill
Hulme 1807 Bishops Hull, Essex
Mary Ann 1810 Kensington

plus your Edward Corbett Bessell

living in Melbourne, I'm not sure if this is one family or a mix as I don't know the geography of England that well.

[atworthy]

Just bumping up my original query to see if anyone can help me with my Lloyd family.

In particular I am trying to find anything about their glove manufacturing business but I don't know where to start.

John Lloyd (my 4th g grandfather) married Charlotte Hetty Chipps (1768-1837) 12 Feb 1793 St Dunstan's in the West. In 1841 he was living in Charles Street. The 1846 burial index had him residing at 5 Charles Street. Both buried at St Luke's Church, Chelsea. He was a glove manufacturer. I have not been able to determine his birth date or parents.

His son was Henry Lloyd who married Caroline Jane Bessell  - info in previous posts.

They had a brother John Lloyd (1808-1889) who was a hosier. I have found a reference to him going bankrupt, before he also came out to Victoria, Australia in 1853.

If anyone can help me find John Lloyd's birth/parents or anything on the glove manufacturing business, I would be most grateful. TIA.

[ciderdrinker]

Hi
His burial gives a birth year of 1767 if that helps Burried 20.7.1846 of Charles St
possible baptism at Chelsea to Joseph And Ann LLoyd 3.4.1768

Ciderdrinker