Request Help Understanding -Renting House but No Land?

[hallmark]

Sorry...was watching the football!!    Apologies for getting mother wrong for that one!


Sarah Graham Tullygony married in 1830, can I ask are there any details for Parents please?

All I have is  26.3 1830  Sarah Graham Tullygony married Robert Hall  Tullygony 

[oldohiohome]

Union of Monaghan, County Monaghan
Dated December 18, 1860

Griffith's
Tullygony Townland, Tedavnet Parish

Parcel 3b
Thomas Graham, house from Patick McAree

none of the three other places you mention are in the same parish

https://www.johngrenham.com/c_parish/c_parish_main.php?civilparishid=1970&civilparish=Tedavnet&county=Monaghan

for maps of each townland, separately
https://www.townlands.ie/en/monaghan/monaghan/tehallan/tehallan/tullygony/

and you can use google maps to see where they are in relation to each other.  the three you mentioned are too far from Tullygony for it to be the same man.

http://www.rootschat.com/links/01nrt/

this only works if the current names aren't too different from the 1860s names.

[Ruskie]

Why as he was a labourer do you think he rented land anywhere? If he had the Certs would say he was a farmer.

I agree with Sinann. You may have come to the wrong conclusion about your Thomas.

Not specific to this area, but if he was a "labourer" it does not follow that he worked his own (or rented) land.

A labourer would have undertaken any work in the district - you can possibly guess at what that may have been by looking at the industry in the area. If the area was predominantly farming then it is likely he would have been a farm labourer, possibly getting paid by the day for work he did. No work = no pay.

People would generally have walked to their jobs so whatever he did would have been reasonably close to his home.

I hope those assumptions are not too far off. 

[Maiden Stone]

Why as he was a labourer do you think he rented land anywhere? If he had the Certs would say he was a farmer.

Or landholder. One of my ancestors who had a small farm was 'landholder' on some certificates.
A member of a family of ag. labs in England managed to acquire 4 acres to farm on his own account and was therefore a farmer on a census return. Holding land was something to be proud of.
Thomas Graham may have been an agricultural or general labourer. He may have gone over to Britain each year to work, as many Irishmen did.
I agree with what Ruskie has written.

[Ruskie]

Why as he was a labourer do you think he rented land anywhere? If he had the Certs would say he was a farmer.

Or landholder. One of my ancestors who had a small farm was 'landholder' on some certificates.
A member of a family of ag. labs in England managed to acquire 4 acres to farm on his own account and was therefore a farmer on a census return. Holding land was something to be proud of.
Thomas Graham may have been an agricultural or general labourer. He may have gone over to Britain each year to work, as many Irishmen did.

I did not consider that. 

[Maiden Stone]

So many Irishmen went to work as farm labourers in Britain, 'harvest-special' trains operated. My GF was one, returning to Ireland for winter and at other times when family circumstances required. Travel was cheap & efficient.  Some moved around in groups around a county or counties, staying in lodging-houses. I wondered why GF's father had been informant at birth registration of his godson & nephew-by-marriage, son of a co-tenant; a possible explanation is that the father was working away when the baby was born.
Then there were all the Irish 'navvies' who helped to build Victorian Britain.
Going to Britain to earn supplementary income was a tradition throughout 19thC. Like Eastern Europeans in 21stC. Some Eastern Europeans do work similar to what Irish did then, although there's not the same demand for farm labourers.

[Suemagoo]

My only information on Thomas Graham is on his marriage record for 1842 he is living in Tullygony. His burial record advises he was 80 years old when he died in 1882, so 1802 would be a guess for birth. Griffiths valuation gives me a Thomas Graham renting a house only in Tullygony. When I made inquiries about birth records for the Tullygony and or Rafeenan, anything on line advises the records only start at 1822 so where you see the early 1800’s I wish I could access. All the above info as mentioned I got from PRONI or on line. His wife Elizabeth on the marriage record says Rafeenan is where she was living in 1842. They spent their lives in these areas according to marriage, children’s birth records and their burial records. Like I said that’s all I got. May I please ask where you get the information you provided? So frustrating living in Canad🥴🥴🥴

[Suemagoo]

Hey everyone thank you so much! Having read all your thoughts I believe I did get off track regarding Thomas. I think the area of Rafeenan and Tullygony was agriculture so it would make sense if he was a farm labourer. So to fully understand he would work on somebody’s farm get paid and then rented a small house on somebody else’s land.

Maybe also the gaps in the years between his children was when he travelled abroad to find work, either in other parts of Ireland or even England. This is exactly the help I was looking for and I always learn something after people respond. I don’ feel as frustrated as I did before requesting help.

Thank you all so much. Very kind all of you for replying to my request.

Cheers👍🇨🇦☘️

[Sinann]

May I please ask where you get the information you provided? So frustrating living in Canad

I think I speak for most if not all of us when I say you just pick it up, starting with history lessons in school to watching TV documentaries, reading, researching your own family and spending way too much time here on RootsChat. If I had to research a family in the 1860s in Canada I wouldn't have a clue how they lived but I bet you or the people on the Canada board could help me out.