Untangling surname confusion - Hanney or Allen??

[~Rachel~]

Have you traced the lodger William Hanney who is lodging with the family in 1851 (21 b Taunton) in case he is related?

Hello - thank you for this. I believe William Hanney the lodger is Eliza's brother - the only definitive evidence I have on him prior to that is from the 1841 census though, I do not have baptism etc.

[~Rachel~]

Tracing the children, of whom I count 13 - mother’s maiden name varies:

@avm228 This is really useful, thank you, and not something I have seen before. Please can I ask you the source for this?

[~Rachel~]

When did Simon & Eliza marry? If post 1837, who is named as her father on the marriage certificate?

I believe it was 1839 - I will order the certificate. After having Fanny's birth cert with the names and dates it didn't occur to me to take the next step back which is pretty daft of me really. Thank you!

[avm228]

Have you traced the lodger William Hanney who is lodging with the family in 1851 (21 b Taunton) in case he is related?

Hello - thank you for this. I believe William Hanney the lodger is Eliza's brother - the only definitive evidence I have on him prior to that is from the 1841 census though, I do not have baptism etc.

The 1841 census doesn’t state relationships.  Do you mean 1851?  Even then he is a lodger with the Radfords, with no other relationship stated.  I would think he’s likely to be related to Eliza but wouldn’t leap to any conclusions as to what the relationship was without evidence.

Looking therefore for evidence- a possible baptism: 

16 January 1831 St Mary Magdalene, Taunton

William Hanney, son of John (labourer) and Elizabeth, of North St [birthdate not noted].


This William did have a sister Eliza, baptised (together with a brother John) on 30 Jan 1820 at St James, Taunton.  No indication of either child’s birthdate.  Interesting given that the second marriage certificate shows her father as a John.

In case John & Elizabeth Hanney do turn out to be Eliza’s parents, they seem to have married as John Hanney and Elizabeth Chapman, 29 May 1817 at St James, Taunton.

[avm228]

Tracing the children, of whom I count 13 - mother’s maiden name varies:

@avm228 This is really useful, thank you, and not something I have seen before. Please can I ask you the source for this?

Mother’s maiden name is now indexed on GRO Online for birth registrations over 100 years ago.

[~Rachel~]

Tracing the children, of whom I count 13 - mother’s maiden name varies:

@avm228 This is really useful, thank you, and not something I have seen before. Please can I ask you the source for this?

Mother’s maiden name is now indexed on GRO Online for birth registrations over 100 years ago.

Well this is a game changer!! I haven't done much research over the past few years, I didn't realise.

Can I ask how you set your search parameters to come up with all those names so quickly, or what the best method of using the tool is?

[avm228]

To be honest it’s a clunky search function.  You have to run the search multiple times because males and females have to be searched separately, the maximum date range for each search is only +/- 2 years and you can only search on one registration district at a time (or none) not e.g. a county.  For names the “phonetically similar” search is the most fuzzy/broad but in my view is misleadingly titled as many results do not seem to be phonetically similar.  Having said all that, it is indeed a hugely useful development.

I suggest you practise using it with this family - see if you can generate the list I put together, and if you don’t find any one of them I can suggest why/how in each case.

The other big gamechanger on the the freshly-indexed GRO Online is that ages at death are now indexed right back to 1837 (not from 1866 only, as per FreeBMD and the underlying old paper/typed indexes on which it is based).

Also all entries on GRO Online show middle names in full, even for those entries where the previous published index reduced middle names to initials.

[~Rachel~]

To be honest it’s a clunky search function. 

That's putting it mildly! Have spent a fair amount of time playing around with it this morning.

Simon b. 1839 - mmn unknown
Susan b. 1841 mmn Henry
Louisa b. 1846 mmn Hannay
Robert b. 1848 mmn Hannay (J qtr)
Sarah Ann b. 1848 mmn Hannay  (D qtr - not sure how this quite goes together but can only assume Robert was born at the start of the qtr and Eliza had an immediate pregnancy with a slightly early baby - poor lady!! That or they were late registering)
Edward b. 1850 mmn Henney
Fanny. 1858 mmn Henney (M qtr)
James b. 1858 mmn Henney (M qtr) (first I have heard of him, will search for death record)
Lucy b. 1859 mmn Heenly

So there are a couple I couldn't find from your list, how did you find Caroline?

To add to the complication Fanny Radford b. 1858 is my 2x g grandmother and her brother Simon b. 1839 is my 3x g grandfather - every time I come back to this family I get in knots! I must order the birth cert for him as well actually.

Thanks for all your help with this I really appreciate it.

[~Rachel~]

Actually I must be losing the plot. Now I have gone back I can't even see James Radford b. 1858 at all... weird