Author Topic: Help please! Ancestor who doesn't seem to have been born!  (Read 6199 times)

Offline Maiden Stone

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Re: Help please! Ancestor who doesn't seem to have been born!
« Reply #108 on: Wednesday 12 August 20 23:59 BST (UK) »
2 other RootsChatters have added Horton/Orton from Leicestershire to "Surname Interests".
HORTON, Leicestershire, Cosby/Blaby
ORTON, Leicestershire
"Surname Interests" is on brown section at foot of this page. Click on it for access.
You can add your own Horton family.
Cowban

Offline Ladyhawk

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Re: Help please! Ancestor who doesn't seem to have been born!
« Reply #109 on: Thursday 13 August 20 00:01 BST (UK) »
22nd Oct 1853 The Galway  Mercury

Government  Collection

WILD BEASTS

Shortly will arrive in Galloway

Important Novelties

Beneficial public information

Lists many animals.......

at end of Article

The Zoological Academy  is enlivened by a splendid Brass Band Leader Mr Thomas Horton R.A. Agent in advance Professor Lee.

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Offline Ladyhawk

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Re: Help please! Ancestor who doesn't seem to have been born!
« Reply #110 on: Thursday 13 August 20 00:03 BST (UK) »
But - who is Alfred? That’s the real search.

It would be great if we could find his mother‘s name
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Offline Ever Stealthy

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Re: Help please! Ancestor who doesn't seem to have been born!
« Reply #111 on: Thursday 13 August 20 00:15 BST (UK) »
Hello everyone! Apologies for not commenting on all the amazing discoveries you have made today. Unfortunately that pesky thing called real life got in the way of more important stuff  ;)

Thanks so much for all this. What a can of worms I opened when I started this thread! The stuff you've found about Thomas is fantastic. It's been an object lesson in how to use different sources to get an answer. I will order birth certificate of son Thomas to check father and occupation.

The newspaper entry saying Eliza was his second daughter suggests that perhaps the Sarah Adcock baptised 3 Jan 1836 to Mary was Thomas'. Alfred b. 1842 could also be theirs out of wedlock. I suspect that Thomas and Mary were "together" for some time, then finally decided to marry while in Edinburgh, and the other children followed. Without a baptism for Alfred, we can only surmise.

Lizzie, I did have the Buxton newspaper report of Alfred's illness, thanks. He died of TB, although the family story has it that he left his second wife with two children, ran off to Liverpool with a younger woman, and drank himself to death! We have a photo of him with his face rubbed out - ouch! His wife remarried a man called Thomas Greenhalgh, and when Alfred's youngest daughter got married in 1899, she named him and not Alfred as her father on the registration. Had we not known the history, it would have caused some confusion and speculation in itself!

The musical gene was passed on: his grandson, also called Alfred, was lead trumpet in the Harry Roy swing band in the 20's and 30's - a big deal, I believe.





Offline Ever Stealthy

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Re: Help please! Ancestor who doesn't seem to have been born!
« Reply #112 on: Thursday 13 August 20 00:21 BST (UK) »
Maiden Stone: thanks for pointing out the Leicestershire Surname section. I'll have a look tomorrow. Yikes! Make that today!
 

Offline Maiden Stone

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Re: Help please! Ancestor who doesn't seem to have been born!
« Reply #113 on: Thursday 13 August 20 01:09 BST (UK) »
If the stint at Grassmarket was an annual fixture, it would account for the Edinburgh marriage.

Historical info about Grassmarket from Official Guide to Edinburgh
https://edinburgh.org/discover/explore-areas/grassmarket/
Historic marketplace (cattle and horses) and event space in Old Town district of Edinburgh. Events included public executions. There was a large number of very cheap lodging-houses in 19thC. Pic. of statue of Greyfriars Bobby, Candlemakers Row.*
* Abode of Thomas at marriage was Candlemakers Row. Mary's abode was Grassmarket. (Reply #66_)
Wiki article about Grassmarket has a scene painted 1845. 
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Offline Maiden Stone

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Re: Help please! Ancestor who doesn't seem to have been born!
« Reply #114 on: Thursday 13 August 20 01:18 BST (UK) »
Posting this one for cross checking:

Sep 1841 Qtr - Alfred Orton mmn Clarke Billesdon 15 43.

However there is also a William Orton registered in 1838 mmn Clark.

Is probably not our man, but there were no further Orton/Horton births mmn Clark/e in Billesdon after Alfred.

Has this Alfred been accounted for?
I'm just wondering if Thomas had 2 families at the same time. (Not wishing to cast aspersions, but if he was frequently away from home ...).
Cowban

Online heywood

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Re: Help please! Ancestor who doesn't seem to have been born!
« Reply #115 on: Thursday 13 August 20 05:44 BST (UK) »
There are a couple of Orton/Clark/e marriages according to published trees but Alfred not included.
There is a William with parents John and Sarah in Leicester in 1841.
There is a death in 1842 - Alfred Orton, 0 yrs,  Leicester.
There is a death in 1843 x William Orton in Leicester.

Burton Overy is within Billesdon registration district and 1851 2089/1 shows John and Sarah Orton with children - mmn Clark.

It doesn’t look as though Alfred b Billesdon is ours.

As the Orton/Horton /Adcock children all seem to be born after the marriage, I doubt that John and Mary were  together for several years before that. Unless the children were born and died elsewhere  :-\


With regard to Eliza being the 2nd daughter, that might be based on the first daughter being Jane who died.
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Offline Ever Stealthy

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Re: Help please! Ancestor who doesn't seem to have been born!
« Reply #116 on: Thursday 13 August 20 08:39 BST (UK) »
Of course, I forgot about Jane  :-\

As you said, despite all this fantastic information, we are no nearer pinning down Alfred's mother, whether it was Mary Adcock before she and Thomas were married, or a wife from a previous marriage that we haven't found.