Author Topic: Denial of heritage?  (Read 1799 times)

Offline Guy Etchells

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Re: Denial of heritage?
« Reply #18 on: Saturday 24 October 20 20:27 BST (UK) »
Racist aggression in Scotland against the English is a piece of nonsense, when did the English become a race for a start?

Skoosh.

Race discrimination is when you’re treated unfairly because of one of the following things: colour, nationality, ethnic origin, national origin.
The 2011 census included the following ethnic groups English, Welsh, Scottish, Northern Irish or British.

Wikipedia states- "The English people are an ethnic group and a nation native to England, who speak the English language of the Indo-European language family and share a common history and culture..."

In 1999 an English couple won an out of court settlement from a Scottish couple.They had alleged unlawful discrimination under the Race Relations Act, a claim which was backed by the Commission for Racial Equality. Note they did not win the court case as it was settled out of court but it shows there were grounds for complaint. I could go on but you get the gist.

Cheers
Guy
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Offline pharmaT

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Re: Denial of heritage?
« Reply #19 on: Saturday 24 October 20 21:50 BST (UK) »
I consider everyone to have their own different interests.  It doesn't bother me that others aren't interested.  It does bother me when people get annoyed with me for doing it.  I don't make them listen to it. I'll maybe say I'm going to do some family history on my day off if asked what I'm going to do but don't regale them with details and I don't demand they join in.  I respect their hobbies, they should respect mine AFIAC.
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Offline maggbill

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Re: Denial of heritage?
« Reply #20 on: Sunday 25 October 20 00:31 BST (UK) »
Hi Everyone,

While I have been sleeping peacefully - there have been lots of comments on my post - Thanks for that.  And I do agree with you all. 

I am convinced of the value of knowing our heritage and backgrounds - and am not swayed by others opinions.  Must say though that even if their opinions don't change mine, there can be ways of researching, and Telling the stories whether everyone is listening or not.  Options to have 'private trees" online are good - but is that good enough to truly protect the "privacy" of those who are not genealogy inclined??  Must say though my tree is private I do see other trees online which are not, and some of them have major, major faults and mistakes.  One other important point I think is to be able to research and tell the story within a social framework of the time.

So if as families can be major issues seen to be "faults" "mistakes" - is it true, that depending on what social strata we belong to, the faults can be seen to be more less acceptable.  Programmes on various royal families and historical figures can bring forth issues which were fine in their day, - but if the same issues happened now to just the ordinary "Joe Bloggs" - people would put their hands up in horror.  Absolutely extreme case?  Recent programme about the Egyptian Pharaohs and their "lineages".  Scientists have proved that in fact it was not just accepted but expected that a Pharaoh would "marry" and have children with his own siblings - The reasoning being, that a Pharaoh was a God, and they could only carry their line onwards, "undiluted" by having children with their own siblings who were also "Gods"!!!!!   
Hey who could possibly say that Genealogy is boring!!!! 
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Offline Rena

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Re: Denial of heritage?
« Reply #21 on: Sunday 25 October 20 01:43 BST (UK) »
Racist aggression in Scotland against the English is a piece of nonsense, when did the English become a race for a start?

Skoosh.

Race discrimination is when you’re treated unfairly because of one of the following things: colour, nationality, ethnic origin, national origin.
The 2011 census included the following ethnic groups English, Welsh, Scottish, Northern Irish or British.

Wikipedia states- "The English people are an ethnic group and a nation native to England, who speak the English language of the Indo-European language family and share a common history and culture..."

Cheers
Guy

I recall several people (usually men) were taken to court due to the fact that they had written their nationality as "English" on the 2001 census form during the Blair/Brown reign..

People could tick they were born in England but their nationality had to be one type of "British" from a tick box British list..

Although there was no mention that  the best country in the UK had been banned, I did wonder if I would be singled out and frog marched to court, as I had written my nationality as being "Yorkshire".
Aberdeen: Findlay-Shirras,McCarthy: MidLothian: Mason,Telford,Darling,Cruikshanks,Bennett,Sime, Bell: Lanarks:Crum, Brown, MacKenzie,Cameron, Glen, Millar; Ross: Urray:Mackenzie:  Moray: Findlay; Marshall/Marischell: Perthshire: Brown Ferguson: Wales: McCarthy, Thomas: England: Almond, Askin, Dodson, Well(es). Harrison, Maw, McCarthy, Munford, Pye, Shearing, Smith, Smythe, Speight, Strike, Wallis/Wallace, Ward, Wells;Germany: Flamme,Ehlers, Bielstein, Germer, Mohlm, Reupke


Offline a chesters

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Re: Denial of heritage?
« Reply #22 on: Sunday 25 October 20 02:18 GMT (UK) »
In the 2016 Australian census there were a few questions regarding ancestry.

Q6: Are you Aboriginal or Torres Strait Islander origin.

Q10: Are you an Australian Citizen

Q11: In what country were you born

Q13: In what country was your father born

Q14: In what country was your mother born

Q17: What is your ancestry

For Q17, there were 7 countries stated, and the other, for you to fill out.

Quite innocuous questions. I do not recall any problems about them.

AC

Offline Guy Etchells

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Re: Denial of heritage?
« Reply #23 on: Sunday 25 October 20 07:20 GMT (UK) »
Hi Everyone,

While I have been sleeping peacefully - there have been lots of comments on my post - Thanks for that.  And I do agree with you all. 

I am convinced of the value of knowing our heritage and backgrounds - and am not swayed by others opinions.  Must say though that even if their opinions don't change mine, there can be ways of researching, and Telling the stories whether everyone is listening or not.  Options to have 'private trees" online are good - but is that good enough to truly protect the "privacy" of those who are not genealogy inclined??  Must say though my tree is private I do see other trees online which are not, and some of them have major, major faults and mistakes.  One other important point I think is to be able to research and tell the story within a social framework of the time.

So if as families can be major issues seen to be "faults" "mistakes" - is it true, that depending on what social strata we belong to, the faults can be seen to be more less acceptable.  Programmes on various royal families and historical figures can bring forth issues which were fine in their day, - but if the same issues happened now to just the ordinary "Joe Bloggs" - people would put their hands up in horror.  Absolutely extreme case?  Recent programme about the Egyptian Pharaohs and their "lineages".  Scientists have proved that in fact it was not just accepted but expected that a Pharaoh would "marry" and have children with his own siblings - The reasoning being, that a Pharaoh was a God, and they could only carry their line onwards, "undiluted" by having children with their own siblings who were also "Gods"!!!!!   
Hey who could possibly say that Genealogy is boring!!!! 

I keep reading about “privacy” in the last few years but what is “privacy”?

Here in the UK there are no laws of  “privacy”, there are laws created to prevent the state, government and the authorities interfering with the private lives of population, which these days are being hijacked to prevent public information being displayed, i.e. censorship!
This was enshrined in laws such as the Convention for the Protection of Human Rights and Fundamental Freedoms (Human Rights Act), signed in 1950.

A number of years ago the Information Commissioner (the person responsible for enforcing the Data Protection Act, etc. made a statement that “It was acceptable for individuals to publish details such details of birth and marriage on their personal websites and online family trees”. Since then amateur censors of all shapes and sizes decry people who do so.
This has the knock on effect of organisations such as the General Record Office (GRO), breaking the law by creating an office policy of insisting people provide details such as Father's Name & Surname before supplying recent (non historic) birth certificates rather than just the GRO reference as required by law.
That in turn breaks the Human Rights Act section 8 dealing with “family life”.

In a similar (and sometimes connected) way the official paperwork connected with births and deaths may not be correct. E.G. The father of a child born to a married woman is assumed by the authorities to be her husband unless it can be shown “he did not have access to her” during the relevant time period. However family knowledge may know the true picture and record someone different from the recorded father. Over time that family knowledge may be forgotten, confused or even denied unless it has been written down somewhere, perhaps in a family tree.
We are now in a period when DNA is revealing that some historically accepted “facts” are now dubious assertions.
Cheers
Guy

http://anguline.co.uk/Framland/index.htm   The site that gives you facts not promises!
http://burial-inscriptions.co.uk Tombstones & Monumental Inscriptions.

As we have gained from the past, we owe the future a debt, which we pay by sharing today.