Author Topic: Craig - flax farmers in Gortree  (Read 3696 times)

Offline RobbityBob

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Craig - flax farmers in Gortree
« on: Thursday 17 December 20 05:32 GMT (UK) »
My gg.grandfather John Craig (18.10.1829-26.7.1894) came to Australia in 1850 and was a successful flax farmer in Victoria, Aus.   John's father William Craig was apparently flax farming at Gortree Ireland and I imagine eldest son John was a great help to him.
Searching Griffiths Valuation, I have found records for William Craig at 2 different Gortree locations with flax mills etc nearby.  My question is which Gortree?
I'm definitely leaning towards number 1 Clondermot because the land size, but I also know that John successfully grew flax in a home garden for test/demo purposes.
Which option would you pick? Other ideas?

Offline Elwyn Soutter

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Re: Craig - flax farmers in Gortree
« Reply #1 on: Thursday 17 December 20 10:32 GMT (UK) »
Most farmers in Ireland grew a combination of crops (oats, barley, hay and potatoes being common). It’s unlikely that the whole farm was given over to flax. And crop rotation requires some variation otherwise you exhaust the soil.

Rather than more or less guessing, I’d research both farms forward, using the Valuation Revision records and statutory marriage & death records to see if either John remained in Ireland. That may tell you whether you have the right farm. If William dies and the farm passes to John, then you know it isn’t the right farm. Likewise if there’s a John who marries and is still in Ireland post 1850.

Do you have your John’s mother’s name from an Australian marriage or death certificate? In which case have you tried to find her death, as that could tell you where the family lived.

What denomination were the Craig family? Have you searched church records in Ireland (the relevant parishes are All Saints for Donegal and Clondermot for Co. Londonderry) for your William’s baptism.
Elwyn

Offline RobbityBob

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Re: Craig - flax farmers in Gortree
« Reply #2 on: Thursday 17 December 20 12:54 GMT (UK) »
Thankyou for those suggestions Elwyn. I'll reply to them in order below.
  • I hadnt thought about multiple crops but that makes sense. In Australia John was farming a number of crops with flax being just one of them; others included hay, potatoes, maize and peas.
  • William's farm did not pass to John. John came to Australia in 1850, married in 1863 and died in Aus in 1894 (aged 64). He never returned to Ireland. He was the eldest of 3 children, his two siblings (William Jnr and Susan) came to Aus together in 1858 and also died here. It appears that his parents never left Ireland.
  • I have limited information on John's parents. His father William was born 27.7.1810 (unverified) and I don't know his date of death. His mother is Sarah Semple Brown born 1807 and died at Gortree 11.2.1867. The death notice (see attached) mentions she died at her residence at Gortree and it implies that husband Wm was still alive.
  • William and Sarah's denomination is Presbyterian I think, as John is listed as Presb in the shipping register when he emigrated. I have an AncestryUK subscription and I've searched again just now but still cant find any birth or baptism record for John (or Ernest John as he is sometimes called) via official or parish records. I tried searching via his record and also using the card catalog - no luck either way.
I'll keep hunting. Any further ideas welcomed.

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Offline Elwyn Soutter

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Re: Craig - flax farmers in Gortree
« Reply #3 on: Thursday 17 December 20 15:29 GMT (UK) »
Sarah’s death is on the GRONI website as being registered in Londonderry.  Those records only contain deaths in what is now Northern Ireland, so I’d assume your family lived at the Co. Londonderry Gortree.  You have to pay to view deaths for the years 1864 to 1870. You can view the original certificate on-line on the GRONI website, using the “search registrations” option:

https://geni.nidirect.gov.uk

You will need to open an account and buy some credits. It costs £2.50 (sterling) to a view a certificate.  The certificate should confirm the county and townland for you.

William Craig death 1887:

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1887/06224/4781101.pdf

I found a  marriage for a Sarah Ann Craig of Gortree (daughter of William) in 1863. She married at Gortnessy Presbyterian church. Tradition was to marry in the bride’s church so that’s probably the family church.

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1863/09653/5501058.pdf

If you want to search the other marriages in that area, you may find more family.

Clearly your John had more siblings than you were aware of, and I don’t think he was the eldest.  Or this is not the correct family.

There was still a Craig family farming there in 1901:

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Londonderry/Lough_Enagh/Gortree/1527980/

David in 1901 was the son of William Craig, so a brother to your ancestor John. (The farm usually went to the eldest son. The others had to make their own way in the world).  Here’s David's marriage:

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1864/11617/8276871.pdf

Probate of the Will of David Craig late of Gortree County Londonderry Farmer who died 10 July 1903 granted at Londonderry to Connolly Craig and John M'Auley Farmers.

Probate of the Will of Connolly Craig late of Gortree, Drumahoe, Co. Londonderry, farmer, who died 23 June 1918 granted at Londonderry to Emma Martha jane Craig and Sarah Annetta Craig, both of Ardmore, spinsters. Effects: £229 15s 0d.

Possible family churches are 1st Glendermott – no baptism records exist, marriages from 1845; 2nd Glendermott baptisms from 1855, marriages 1845; Gortnessy baptisms from 1839 and marriages from 1845. None of the baptism records are on-line so far as I am aware but there are copies in PRONI in Belfast. The marriages are on the irishgenealogy site.
Elwyn


Offline RobbityBob

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Re: Craig - flax farmers in Gortree
« Reply #4 on: Sunday 20 December 20 14:12 GMT (UK) »
Thank you again Elwyn for your assistance.

I purchased some credits and checked the death record for Sarah. I can confirm she died at Gortree, Glendermott on 11.2.1867 (age 60) with William Craig present. Listed as married and occupation as farmers wife. These facts fit with our Sarah.
The link you set for Williams death on 8.2.1887 (age 87) also shows location as Gortree, Glendermot. I noticed there was a Charlotte Craig granddaughter present at the death, so that could be a useful lead however I haven't found her on a census or marriage record yet.

I had not discovered David Craig or Sarah Ann Craig before - so these are useful leads to explore further - thanks again.

William Craig's farm on Griffiths 1858 valuation at Gortree Clondermot and the property described on David Craig's 1901 census certainly appear to be the same property described as house #9 Gortree Clondermot.

I have looked for BDM records relating to the Gortnessy Meeting House to no avail. I did find a Facebook group for the church and there are graveyard photos that I might be able to enquire about.

I agree with you that the CRAIG family is bigger than I was led to believe - or this one is the wrong family. I think the two keys I need to confirm these are my ancestors are either...
1. a primary source linking (Ernest) John CRAIG to these parents. No census or birth cert found yet. John's marriage and death cert mention parents names Wm and Sarah (common) and Londonderry birthplace which is broad. This may be all I'll ever find.
2. something else def linking John to the farm property at house #9 Gortree (other than a family story). I recall someone mentioned a book that once belonged to John with his name and "Gortree" written inside the front cover - I should follow this up to request a scan or photo.

There is an anomoly too. A William Bannatyne Craig who died in Australia in 1858! To me, he doesn't feel like our William but he died at Moolap Victoria where John Craig lived. Might be correct but there's no other clear connection - it feels like someone found him on Ancestry and added him, then others got excited and followed suit. I need to search further to rule him out or in.

Offline aghadowey

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Re: Craig - flax farmers in Gortree
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 20 December 20 14:45 GMT (UK) »
There's a marriage for a Charlotte Craig of Gortree in 1896- her father David Craig which might fit with census link posted earlier. Marriage was in Gortnessy Presbyterian Church and one of the witnesses was an Emma Craig.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1896/10490/5820100.pdf

Here's the Ferguson family-
https://census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Londonderry/Lough_Enagh/Gortree/1527972/
https://census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Londonderry/Lough_Enagh/Gortree/598905/

Added- Charlotte born 1870- parents David Craig & Sarah Reid-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1870/03335/2222472.pdf
Away sorting out DNA matches... I may be gone for some time many years!

Offline aghadowey

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Re: Craig - flax farmers in Gortree
« Reply #6 on: Sunday 20 December 20 14:52 GMT (UK) »
Charlotte (Craig) Ferguson died 1916-
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1916/05252/4455996.pdf

Husband James married again in 1918 which explains the Will Extract below.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1918/09728/5529618.pdf

Ferguson James of Gortree Drumahoe county Londonderry farmer died 6 December 1936 Administration Londonderry 16 July [1937] to Mary Jane Ferguson the widow. Effects £268 2s. 4d.
Away sorting out DNA matches... I may be gone for some time many years!

Offline aghadowey

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Re: Craig - flax farmers in Gortree
« Reply #7 on: Sunday 20 December 20 15:03 GMT (UK) »
It's not often I disagree with Elwyn's posts but the bit below is now always correct-
Quote
(The farm usually went to the eldest son. The others had to make their own way in the world).

In Ulster is wasn't uncommon for men to marry later in life- sometimes waiting until after parents were deceased or elderly. Also, farms were in general quite small and could often only support one family which is why you might find one son stayed in the home place while others moved elsewhere for work. Consider this scenario-
Father married around age 30 and had 6 or 7 children over the next 20 years. If eldest son was born when father was 30 then father was only in early 50s when son was about 20- likely still farming with quite a few of his other children still at home. So, eldest son might go looking for work (sometimes in the neighbourhood but just as likely to Scotland, Canada, America, Australia, etc.). This pattern might continue with other sons. Now, by the time the youngest son was around 20 the father is in his 70s and has either died or not able to look after farm on his own. So, this is the son who stays home to look after the elderly relatives, unmarried sisters, etc.
Away sorting out DNA matches... I may be gone for some time many years!

Offline Elwyn Soutter

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Re: Craig - flax farmers in Gortree
« Reply #8 on: Sunday 20 December 20 20:31 GMT (UK) »
Robbity,

As far as the Gortnessy Presbyterian church baptism records are concerned, I don’t think you’ll find them on-line. Sometimes there’s a perception that most genealogical records are on-line these days. That’s not the case in Ireland especially for many Protestant denominations.  There are some Presbyterian records on reputable commercial sites eg rootsireland but many are not on-line. A high percentage of records for the counties of Ulster are in PRONI (where they are usually on microfilm) and a small number are still held by the Minister. Gortnessy's have been copied and are in PRONI.

You could contact Gortnessy Presbyterian church but I hesitate to encourage that when their records are in PRONI. Many Ministers are very accommodating about looking up records but others get rather too many requests and have better things to do, and just don’t reply. If you do write to the church, enclosing a donation may improve your chances. Assuming I am correct about Gortnessy being the family church, then the baptism records are going to be of slightly limited value. They only start in 1839. If your John was born c 1829, then clearly his parents could have had quite a few children before 1839. However there may have been some after that too. So you may find details of their baptisms but you won’t get the whole family.

A personal visit is required to view the PRONI records. Access is free. This link explains what records exist, parish by parish:

https://www.nidirect.gov.uk/publications/proni-guide-church-records

If you are unable to go yourself, you could employ a researcher. Researchers in the PRONI area: http://sgni.net


Regarding confirming the continuity of the farm at Gortree, you will see in 1858 that Griffiths listed Wm Craig as being on plot 8a. It was the only Craig household listed in the townland. (There were only about 9 farms). There is a set of records that takes Griffiths forward. Called the Valuation Revision records (or sometimes the Cancelled books) they go up to  c1929 and show changes in occupancy, acreage and buildings. Those records are on the PRONI website (and are viewable on-line):

https://apps.proni.gov.uk/Val12B/Search.aspx

The records show the plot 8 farm passing from William to David Craig in 1876.  So I think that, and David’s marriage certificate, confirms the link. By 1929 the farmhouse was occupied by William McLoughlan and the land farmed by Alex Hogg.

Looking at the tithe applotment records for 1834, there wasn’t a Craig farm listed in Gortree then.

http://www.irishgenealogyhub.com/derry/tithe-applotments/clondermot-parish.php

Nor was there a Craig household in the townland in the 1831 census. So I think the family arrived in Gortree after 1831 and probably after 1834.  But they were probably living nearby. (Based on what was typical). I searched the 1831 census for a William Craig elsewhere in the parish of Glendermot. I found 2, both Presbyterian families:

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1831/Londonderry/Tirkeeran/Glendermot/Gortecross/6/

That could be William & Sarah with 2 sons and 1 daughter but it could be a mother in law, elderly unmarried uncle or who knows what. No way of knowing as the names and relationships weren’t recorded in that census. Here’s the second William:

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1831/Londonderry/Tirkeeran/Glendermot/Tullyally_Upper/7/

I haven’t researched these families forward but I mention them just as a possible hint as to where your William was in 1831.

You have mentioned William Bannatyne Craig, and you are uncertain of where he fits in. Perhaps you noticed that the farm next to the Craigs in Gortree in 1858 was held by the Ballantyne family (plot 7 next to their plot).  Without going into a boring explanation, perhaps it’s sufficient to say spelling of names often varied in Ireland. I suspect Ballantyne and Bannatyne are probably the same. So William B Craig is perhaps named after a neighbour, or is descended from a marriage to a neighbour.  Someone perhaps married the girl next door.

Aghadowey has said that it’s not always the case that the eldest son inherited the farm. I am happy concede that point. All I would say is it wasn’t uncommon. But to support her, I did see a case not long ago where there were 3 sons and 1 daughter and the farm went to that unmarried daughter.  Who knows what the reasons were but clearly it didn’t follow the tradition I proposed.

You are looking for a census or birth certificate showing who (Ernest) John Craig’s parents are. I very much doubt you will find either. The 1831 census didn’t list children’s names and the 1841 & 1851 censuses have largely been destroyed. (Some fragments exist. I have checked the ones I have access to but did not find your family). If Ernest John was baptised in Gortnessy Presbyterian c 1829, then no records exist.

You might be looking at DNA testing with some of the other apparent descendants of William & Sarah to see if there’s a link?
Elwyn