John MOLLOY and Anne/Ann DALY

[haney]

Hi I'm doing research on John Molloy born in Monaghan c 1811 to Henry MOLLOY and Mary LAMB, according to his marriage record here in NSW in 1864.  John listed as a "Widower" by then!

John arrived on board the "Brothers" ship to NSW in 1841 with his wife Ann Daly she was the daughter of a Peter Daly a Carpenter she was also a native of Monaghan.

  John was aged 30, A blacksmith on the Assisted Immigration record and looks like a Father P Bellen baptised both John Molloy, his wife Ann Daly and this couples three children:- Charlotte 10, Charles 6 and Mary 18months.

Henry is listed as John's father, it does not say deceased on the immigration record for Henry he is also a Blacksmith.

I'm trying to find any birth records of the three children Charlotte, Charles and Mary hopefully.  Also possibly the marriage/birth record of John.  All Catholic.  Thanks for any help.  Kind regards Dianna

[Neale1961]

There is a RC baptism for Maria MULLOY with those parents named - 9 Sept 1839 from the Diocese of Clogher, Monaghan.
All written in Latin.

[haney]

HI I see your on the case again, bless you.  LOL.  So are you thinking that Maria MULLOY is actually (possibly!) the Mary aged 18months on the immigration record??  At least we have the priests name, may help???  Thanks D

[majm]

Great thinking from Neale, as usual.  Well found..

 The ink on Handwritten documents relies on the quality of the paper as well as the quality of the nib and the amount of ink flowing with each up and downbstroke.   And that's before knowing if the record was recorded at the time or perhaps a day, days, weeks, or longer after the event... So Mulloy is likely a variation ...

JM

[heywood]

There is a RC baptism for Maria MULLOY with those parents named - 9 Sept 1839 from the Diocese of Clogher, Monaghan.
All written in Latin.

Here it is - the priest John Caulfield
https://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000632885#page/42/mode/1up

Baptisms are only recorded from November 1835.

[heywood]

https://www.from-ireland.net/parishes-diocese-of-clogher-tyrone-1846/

This document shows Rev P Bellew as Dean of Muckna/o parish (Castleblayney) in 1840s.

That is perhaps the priest mentioned for the baptisms.

[Neale1961]

On the ships passenger register. It says that the “person certifying registry of baptism” is P. Bellew.
I don’t think that is necessarily the same person who baptised them – just the person who verified that it had been done.

Also regarding the ages. I believe that the ages recorded on the ship's passenger list were at the time of departure, which was in Sept 1840. Arrival in NSW was March 1841. So as John is recorded as 30 years, his birth would most likely be 1810, and wife Ann born 1812.    etc. etc. Therefore the children Charlotte born 1830, Charles born 1834, and Mary born April 1839.
This would put the marriage for John Molloy and Ann Daly around 1829.

[Neale1961]

I believe I have the baptism for Charles Molloy or in Latin “ Carolus Molloy” at Muckno, Monaghan; Diocese of Clogher. The document is in very poor condition and extremely difficult to read. The year is 1840. The date is not possible to read, but by going backwards in the registry, I would say it must be after May of that year. The name of the sponsor looks like Samuel …….   Parents names are completely obscured.

Perhaps Rev. P Bellew discovered Charles Molloy was not baptised, so a hasty baptism was arranged before the family emigrated.

(My ancestors who emigrated from Warwickshire to Queensland in 1848 did the same thing with some of their children who were not baptised. Their 3 youngest children were all hastily baptised together on the same day, just before their departure.)

[majm]

Yes,  the Emigration Commissioners interviewed the candidates, and collected details about those candidates.  The info on the Immigration paperwork currently being digitised by commercial family history website businesses and drawn from the original records of colonial administrations (eg NSW State Archives among others... ) was based on what we can now recognise as a primitive form of ID ....

Sometimes a diligent EMigration Agent sought and the candidate then obtained from a clergyman confirming identifying details about the head of a migrating family, his spouse, their children, names/ages, occupation/s, their parentage, birth places, religion, health status...  So sometimes part of that info  MAY have be written down on the reverse side of some individual entries, or details of male children found on their Dad's entry and daughters on Mum's.   Also sometimes a person aged 14 years or older was counted as an adult (ie adult fares, so adult allocation for meals, etc) So NOT listed in family group but as a single elsewhere in the passenger manifest.
 Also, look for possibke adult siblings  or patents of John  and Ann/e,  on that passenger list ...... 

 
So a baptism certificate was often used as a form of providing identity.    

JM