Author Topic: All Things DOWNING/DOWNEY in County Derry  (Read 6471 times)

Offline dukewm

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Re: All Things DOWNING/DOWNEY in County Derry
« Reply #54 on: Tuesday 18 July 23 22:22 BST (UK) »
Part 2 of 3

As to the original 1734 lease, we refer to as "Stafford's Lease,
the copy I got from Stafford Poole reads as follows;

Dated 30th March 1734 - from William Conolly to Stafford Downing of Dreenan
            Rent and fees 25 Pnds 12 shillings 6 pence, containing
            246 acres 0 roods 7 perches of arable and pasture &
            189 acres 0 roods 30 perches of Bog
            Rent fine: 10 pnds 2 shillings 6 pence
            Lives: Stafford Downing, Bernard Mulholland, and Bryan McCann

Dated 6th October 1782 - from Thomas Conolly to John Downing of Dreenan
1st Renewal      Life Dead: Stafford Downing
            Lives Inserted: James Nesbitt Downing Nesbitt, son of
            Revd. Alexander Clotworthy Downing
                                Lives now being: Bryan McCann, James Nesbitt Downing Nesbitt, and William
                                Downing

Dated 1st November 1787 - from same to John Downing of Dreenan
2nd Renewal      Life Dead: James Nesbitt Downing Nesbitt
                                Life Inserted: Arthur Dawson, son of Arthur Dawson of
            Castledawson
            Lives now being: Bryan McCann, William Downing, and
            Arthur Dawson

Dated 3rd May 1789 - from same to John Downing of Dreenan
3rd Renewal      Life Dead: Bryan McCann
            Life Inserted: (blank in the original)
            Lives now being: William Downing, Arthur Dawson, and
            (life inserted)

Dated 20th October 1791 - from same to John Downing
4th Renewal      Life Dead: Bryan McCann
            Life Inserted: William Dawson, 2nd son of Arthur Dawson
            Lives now being: William Downing, Arthur Dawson, and
            William Dawson, aged 7 years

Dated 20th June 1796 - from same to same
5th Renewal      Life Dead: William Dawson
            Life Inserted: James Maddigan, son of Shane Maddigan of
            Dreenan
            Lives now being: William Downing, Arthur Dawson, and
            James Maddigan

Dated February 1798 - from same to James Downing, William Downing, George
6th Renewal      Downing, and Stafford Downing
            Life Dead: Arthur Dawson
            Life Inserted: Robert Forrester
            Lives now being: William Downing, James Maddigan, and
            Robert Forrester

Dated 1st June 1800 - from same to James Downing, George Downing, Stafford
7th Renewal      Downing, John Downing, and Sarah Downing
            Life Inserted: Ezekiel Downing, son of Dawson Downing
            Lives now being: James Maddigan, Robert Forrester, and
            Ezekiel Downing

Although the original lease could not be found in the FamilySearch database, it’s interesting that Stafford apparently sold the “lands of Upper Dreenan” in 1737, just 3 years after the original grant, to John Downing of Rowesgift, (see Deed Vol 100, img 21), an indication that Stafford was related to John.  At the 1st renewal in 1782, John Downing of Dreenan, likely John of Rowesgift, had replaced Stafford as the Lessee, BUT it’s noted that subsequent renewals in 1787, 1789, 1791, & 1796 all continue to name John of Dreenan, at least until 1791, when he is referred to simply as “John Downing”. 
We know John Downing of Rowesgift had died in 1785.
Also note that by Deed (Vol 194, img 60), dated 20 Dec 1756, Stafford is described as deceased.

Offline dukewm

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Re: All Things DOWNING/DOWNEY in County Derry
« Reply #55 on: Tuesday 18 July 23 22:23 BST (UK) »
Part 3 of 3

You will note that upon the 6th renewal of 1798, we see that the Principle Lessees are named as James, William, George, and Stafford DOWNING. 

There are references to George DOWNING, b. c.1731, that describe him as eldest son of Bernard DOWNING - see eBook
Deed Vol 303 ; Image 309
Deed Vol 189 ; Image 649
It is believed Bernard was the brother of Stafford (the elder) DOWNING of Dreenan, and grandfather to Stafford the 1734 Lessee, by his son John.
George's brothers, as gleaned from deeds and as Principle Lessees to the Stafford Lease, are presumed to be James, William, and Stafford, also John (father of the 1734 Lessee) named in the 7th renewal.  Although all those men would have been in their 60s by the end of the century, and the Principles may have been of a younger generation, but it's unlikely all four names would be identical.

It's also worth noting that 'Sarah', inserted as one of five Principles in 1800, replacing the presumed "life dead" William, could have been the daughter of George DOWNING of Old Town, Ballyscullion, and who had brothers named James, William, and John.  Although that William is known to have died in 1788 (Probate on record), so it's certain he would NOT have been the Principle named in 1798.

On 'William' DOWNING, first named as one of the "lives" in the 1st renewal, dated 6 Oct 1782, I would love to know where he fits in the family tree, because I have yet to positively place my own 4th great grandfather, William.  However, the 'William' mentioned in the lease renewals presumably had passed away sometime between 1798 and 1800, when he is replaced by John and Sarah DOWNING (not necessarily spouses).  My 'William' supposedly survived until 1803 and was probably a flax grower, as were many of the DOWNING farmers of that era.  His son, another 'William', is listed in Slater's Directory of 1846 as a "Linen Manufacturer" of Coagh, a small village just over the southern border in County Tyrone.  Linen is made from flax seeds.

We know the McCann family had some connection to the DOWNINGs of Dreenan, as Bryan McCann is named as one of the three "lives" in the original 1734 lease.

As for the CONVERY family and probable connections to DOWNING and O'NEILL ; there are still CONVERYs living on Rocktown Road to this day, primarily along the eastern end towards Gulladuff Road.

I don't have any information on the CARMICHAEL family.

I may have missed a few things, but wanted to put up a response to several new comments.  Hope you find something of value.


Offline Romandog1947

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Re: All Things DOWNING/DOWNEY in County Derry
« Reply #56 on: Tuesday 18 July 23 23:05 BST (UK) »
In my most recent post prior to this one, I failed to mention several things.

In his 2014 Book "Staggering  Life and Death on the Texas Frontier at Staggers Point " (ISBN 978-1-312-74442-4) my 4th cousin once removed Avrel Seale revealed That Elizabeth Sharon Downing "Bettie" mother was also named Elizabeth.  He also mentions that Bettie's father was a large miller of Flax. This information is family legend and is not documented.

The 1796 Flax Growers List for Maghera lists five Downings growing Flax in Dreenan; Daniel John, George, Stafford and William.

I did not find a baptism for Elizabeth Sharon Downing (b. Jan 1798) but I did find that George Downing and wife Elizabeth baptized five children at St Lurach Church in Maghera.
1. John 21 Oct 1789 (did this child die?)
2. Jane and John  16 Apr 1791
3. William 2 Dec 1792
4 Stafford  6 Sept 1794
The record mentions that Stafford was baptized by the Rev. ??? Downing, Curator of Maghera

I find it interesting that these children were within an age bracket that make them very eligible to have been "Bettie's" siblings.  Is it just a coincidence that Bettie's mother was thought to be an Elizabeth by her Texas descendants and that George's wife is an Elizabeth?

Is it possible that this husband George is the George in the 6th renewal? 

The Tithe Applotment Book for Derry does list Elizabeth Downing between Alexander Downing and George Dowiing.   Are this George and Elizabeth the husband and wife of the children baptized at St. Lurach?    Is the Elizabeth Downing listed as living in Dreenan in 1858 census the same woman?

I don't know the answers to these questions but it ceertainly makes me wonder if George and Elizabeth Downing are my Bettie's parents.

Cheers
Carson

Offline Romandog1947

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Re: All Things DOWNING/DOWNEY in County Derry
« Reply #57 on: Tuesday 18 July 23 23:09 BST (UK) »
And, I forgot to mention that Robert Henry and Elizabeth Sharon Downing (who gave birth to  13 children) named four of them, John, Jane, William and Stafford.

Coincidence?    I'm beginning to think not.

Carson


Offline M_ONeill

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Re: All Things DOWNING/DOWNEY in County Derry
« Reply #58 on: Wednesday 19 July 23 02:25 BST (UK) »
Thanks for the replies everyone, I'll probably be posting a longer response to the thread in the next couple of days or so, but just quickly: I can help you out Rick, with regards to the parents of Stafford Dinnen's wife Bridget O'Neill. The actual paper Catholic record gives the parents of both bride and groom (see attached snippet). Michael Dinnen and Elizabeth Downing for Stafford, Bernard O'Neill and Martha Cassidy for Bridget.

Offline Romandog1947

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Re: All Things DOWNING/DOWNEY in County Derry
« Reply #59 on: Sunday 23 July 23 23:05 BST (UK) »
DukeWM mentioned on the 23rd to reference a Downing ebook.  Which ebook is that?  I may have seen it but it doesn't jog my memory just now.
Carson

Offline dukewm

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Re: All Things DOWNING/DOWNEY in County Derry
« Reply #60 on: Monday 24 July 23 00:24 BST (UK) »
Hi Carson,

The title is “DOWNING DEEDS of DERRY, 1708-1825”
available on Amazon for $0.99

I wanted to offer it free, but Amazon requires a 99 cent minimum.


Offline dukewm

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Re: All Things DOWNING/DOWNEY in County Derry
« Reply #61 on: Monday 24 July 23 14:49 BST (UK) »
In reference to Carson's (Romandog) quest, this is going to get a little complicated, so bear with me. 
It will take several "parts", of which this is Part 1.

From the eBook I cited in Reply # 60, we know that a certain George Downing was the "eldest son and heir at law of Bernard Downing of Ballynease".
I might speculate that this 'George' could be your ancestor.

(from) Transcripts of Memorials of Deeds, Conveyances and Wills, 1708-1929, accessible through Family Search
Ref.: Deed Vol 303, img 309, Film# 8093377, p.595, Mem# 202373, dated 17 Oct 1774
 
"A Memorial of Indented Deeds of Lease and Release bearing date respectively the 17th and 18th days of October 1774 and made between George Downing Gent. Eldest son and Heir at Law of Bernard Downing late of Ballynease in the County of Londonderry Gent. of the one part and Samuel Strean of Magherafelt in the County of Londonderry Gent. of the other part whereby the said George Downing in Consid(eratio)n of 300 pounds ster did Grant Bargain Sell Assign Convey and make over unto the said Saml. Strean all that the North division of Ballynease commonly called Ballyneas Downing Cont(ainin)g by Est. 48 acres and 3 roods Arable and pasture and 8 acres and 1 rood of Bogg plant(atio)n measure be the same more or less in as full ample and beneficial a manner as the same had been theretobefore in the poss(essio)n of the said Bernard Downing the father of the said George Downing and his undertenants and as the same was then in the occupation and enjoyment of the said George Downing and his undertenants with all houses Edifaces buildings Rights members and appurtenances thereunto belonging or in anywise appertaining Situate lying and being within the Manor or proportion of Vintners in the County of Londonderry aforesaid to have and to hold all and singular the said Lands and prem(is)es with their appurtenances tog(ethe)r with the Original Lease of the said prem(is)es under which the said George Downing derived his title thereto made by the Right Hon(oura)ble William Conolly Esquire deceased unto unto the said Bernard Downing unto the said Saml. Strean his heirs and assigns from the (blank) day of (blank) for and during the natural life and lives of the said George Downing and Bernard Mulholland eldest son of Bernard Mulholland of Moyagull in the County of Londonderry aforesaid and the survivor of them and for and during the natural life and lives of such other person and person as sho(ul)d from time to time forever thereafter be nominated appointed added or inserted in or to the term granted in and by the said Indenture of Lease pursuant to the Covenants therein Comprized for renewalls forever Subject to the yearly rent of 6 pounds 18 shillings with 6 pence in the pound receivers fees and the sum of 3 pounds 9 shillings upon the fall of each life and to the performance of the several Coven(an)ts in and by the said Deed (   ?   ) and on the Lessees part to be done and performed and Subj(ec)t or liable to no other charge or Incumbrance whatsoever in which said Deeds there are other Covenants and Clauses and the same tog(ethe)r with this Memorial are witnessed by Charles Hill of Bellaghy in the County of Londonderry Gent. and Andrew Torrens of the City of Dublin Gent. –
George Downing (seal) Signed Sealed and Executed in the presense of us - Charles Hill - Andrew Torrens - The above named Andrew Torrens maketh oath and sayth he is a Subs(cribin)g witness to the Deeds of which the above writing is a Meml. and sayth he saw the same duly Executed by the above named George Downing and sayth he also saw the above named George Downing Execute the above memorial and that the name Andw. Torrens Subs(cribe)d as a witness to the said Deeds and Memorial is Dep(onen)ts proper name and handwriting and that he deliv(ere)d same to Mr. John McCabe Deputy Reg(iste)r at the Regrs. office in the lower Castleyard Dublin the 19th day of Novem(be)r 1774 at or near the hour of 11 o'Clock in the forenoon of said day - Andrew Torrens - sworn the 19th day of November 1774 - Jno McCabe Dep Regr."
Registered: 19th Nov 1774

It is virtually certain that George was alive when William Conolly of Dublin, Agent for the Vintner's Proportion, generated hundreds of leases in County Derry in 1734, his only prolific period. 
George, and the other named "life", Bernard Mulholland, eldest son of Bernard Mulholland of Moyagull, were likely young boys at the time.

The original Townland of Ballynease has apparently been subdivided at some time, probably after the 1831 Census, into three separate Townlands.  Ballynease-Helton is the northernmost of the three, and lies just S and upstream of the Town of Portglenone with a small border on the River Bann.  Ballynease-Macpeake borders the River Bann to the south of Ballynease-Helton and Ballynease-Strain borders the west side of Ballynease-Macpeake, also lying south of Ballynease-Helton. 
The "North division of Ballynease commonly called Ballyneas Downing" in this Deed is probably now the Townland of Ballynease-Helton in the Civil Parish of Ballyscullion, containing 385 acres.   

Offline dukewm

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Re: All Things DOWNING/DOWNEY in County Derry
« Reply #62 on: Monday 24 July 23 14:50 BST (UK) »
Next, the full transcript of; (in two parts)
The Will of John Downing of Dreenan, dated 26 Aug 1782, names in order:
wife, Hester
son, Stafford
brother, James
brother, George
brother, William
brother, Stafford
("in case any one or more of my said brothers should die without leaving lawful issue", indicates they were all probably unmarried in 1782) his/their 1/4th shall be divided share and share alike
mother, unnamed
sister, Margaret Downing, otherwise O'Neill
children of sister,Margaret, unnamed
"natural" son, John
"natural" son, Francis
to wit :
"to my beloved wife Hester one third of all the issues and profits now and hereafter arising out of my freehold lease of the half of Dreenan . . . "
. . . "and also the sum of £100 sterling to be paid by my Executor at a convenient time after the dispersal or auction of my goods and chattels out of the amount of which said hundred pounds is to be
paid likewise a bond for the sum of £200 sterling now in my hands payable to my son [?] Stafford Downing"
"Thirdly I will and bequeath to my brother James Downing and his heirs lawfully begot or to be begotten
one fourth part of my lands in lease of Dreenan aforesaid except the farm of Carrabrack said forth part subject to such annuities as shall be hereinafter mentioned and subject also to pay half yearly
a fourth part of my said wifes dower & likewise a fifth part to all fines of renewal that shall hereafter become due on said lease
Fourthly I leave and bequeath to my brother George Downing and his heirs lawfully begotten or to be begotten one other fourth part of my said lands of Dreenan aforesaid except said farm of 
Carrabrack subject to every article that my said brother James is hereby bound to perform on his part provided that my said brother George shall deliver to me or my order an Instrument in writing
given him by me at his marriage of the part now in his actual possession . . . "
"Fifthly I will and bequeath one other fourth part of my said lands at Dreenan except said farm of Carrabrook to my brother William Downing and his heirs lawfully to be begotten subject also to
every article clause and condition to which my said brother James is already herein bound to do and perform on his part
Sixthly I will and bequeath to my brother Stafford Downing and to his heirs lawfully begot or to be begotten one other fourth part of my said lands of Dreenan except said farm of Carrabrook
subject likewise to every article clause and condition that my said brother James is herein already bound to do so and perform on his part and in case any one or more of my said brothers
should die without leaving lawful issue I order that his or their fourth part or parts shall fall equally to my surviving brother or brothers share and share alike and to the heirs of such surviving
brother or brothers . . . "