Author Topic: Evans hopson Hobson familys  (Read 4092 times)

Offline wilcoxon

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Re: Evans hopson Hobson familys
« Reply #18 on: Saturday 19 June 21 17:13 BST (UK) »
Has anyone found any of this 1891 family in a later census.
Just a coincidence that both Sarah`s were from Oswestry and there`s a Susannah born about the same time and  place  in 1901.

1891
Caravan, Llanybri Road, Llanstephan, Carms RG12/4516 folio 131 pg 15
Thomas Hobson head 36 basket maker b. Salop, Shrewsbury
Sarah wife 37 b. Salop, Oswestry
Mary Ann dau 11 b. Oswestry
Elizabeth dau 10 b. Montgomeryshire, Bettws
Susannah dau 7 b. Radnor, Rhyader
Thomas son 5 b. Carms, Llangennech
Richard son 4 b. Carms, Llanycrwys
Jane dau 2 b. Carms, Llanfiangel
John son 1 b. Carms, Nantgaredy

A Thomas Hobson aged 37 died June qtr 1891  Carmarthen district which covers Llanstephan
 June qtr 1892 a Sarah Hobson married Charles Jones in Rhayader district.

1901 Llangwnog Montgomeryshire
Charles Jones    46 hawker b Berriew Montgomery
Sarah Jones    45 b Oswestry
Jane Jones    14 b Caernarvonshire ?
John Jones    11 b Caernarvonshire ?
Sarah Jones    8 b Llanllwchaiarn, Montgomeryshire
Edward Jones    6 b Newtown, Montgomeryshire
William Jones    3 b Llanwnnog, Montgomeryshire
Lydia Jones    2 b  Llanwnnog, Montgomeryshire
Richard Jones    15 b Penegoes, Caernarvonshire,
Richard Edwards son in law 19
Susanah Edwards dau   18 b Rhyader, Radnorshire,
John Thomas Edwards grandson   10 Months b Llanfair, Montgomeryshire

Census information is Crown Copyright (see: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk)

Offline osprey

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Re: Evans hopson Hobson familys
« Reply #19 on: Saturday 19 June 21 18:50 BST (UK) »
Pretty sure that's the same family!
parish marriage entry 1 April 1892 Llanyre
Charles Jones 35 bach hawker Llanyre father Edward Jones hawker
Sarah Hobson 36 widow Llanyre father Richard Davies (deceased) mason
witnesses William Boswell & Annie Boswell

1901 census gives place of birth for Jane & John Jones as Llandilo, Carmarthenshire and for Richard Penygoes, Carmarthenshire.

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X9BP-WNW

1911 census
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:X7J6-K7R

baptism in Newtown 4 June 1894 Edward son of Charles & Sarah Jones of Astley's Yard
Cornwall: Allen, Bevan, Bosisto, Carnpezzack, Donithorn, Huddy, James, Retallack, Russell, Vincent, Yeoman
Cards: Thomas (Llanbadarn Fawr)
Glam: Bowler, Cram, Galloway, James, Thomas, Watkins
Lincs: Coupland, Cram
Mon: Cram, Gwyn, John, Philpot, Smart, Watkins
Pembs: Edwards (St. Dogmael's)
Yorks: Airey, Bowler, Elliott, Hare, Hewitt, Kellett, Kemp, Stephenson, Tebb

Offline wilcoxon

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Re: Evans hopson Hobson familys
« Reply #20 on: Saturday 19 June 21 19:16 BST (UK) »
Where is the marriage entry. Ancestry ?
Census information is Crown Copyright (see: www.nationalarchives.gov.uk)

Offline osprey

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Re: Evans hopson Hobson familys
« Reply #21 on: Saturday 19 June 21 19:26 BST (UK) »
marriage register is on Findmypast.

baptism 27 April 1882 in Llanidloes John Thomas son of Thomas Hobson, packman, and Sarah of Bethell Street
burial 3 May 1882 in Llanidloes John Thomas Hopson 2 weeks Pencricoed (?)
Cornwall: Allen, Bevan, Bosisto, Carnpezzack, Donithorn, Huddy, James, Retallack, Russell, Vincent, Yeoman
Cards: Thomas (Llanbadarn Fawr)
Glam: Bowler, Cram, Galloway, James, Thomas, Watkins
Lincs: Coupland, Cram
Mon: Cram, Gwyn, John, Philpot, Smart, Watkins
Pembs: Edwards (St. Dogmael's)
Yorks: Airey, Bowler, Elliott, Hare, Hewitt, Kellett, Kemp, Stephenson, Tebb


Offline Talacharn

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Re: Evans hopson Hobson familys
« Reply #22 on: Sunday 29 May 22 17:50 BST (UK) »
The two threads need to be merged.

I believe the Charles Jones and Sarah are listed in Eric Trudgill’s book.
His parents were Edward Jones and Alice Evans.
Edward Jones was the son of Evan and Charlotte
Alice Evans was the daughter of Daniel and Lydia Evans.

Of the children listed by Eric; Sarah 1882, Richard 1884, Jane 1886, John 1890, Sarah 1893, Edward 1894, William 1896, only the final child Lydia, has mmn Hobson, which suggests it was a second marriage for Sarah and the merging of two families.
Lydia Jones . mmn Hobson . Apr-Jun 1899 . Newtown . Volume 11b . Page 155
With such common names, it is difficult to know for sure, but looking for the other children, mmn Davies appeared most.

Of the 1891 and 1901 census records offered by Wilcoxon, I can see the link and that some match the names offered by Eric, but I cannot find birth registrations. I looked for each child as Hopson/Hobson and Jones. Either they were not registered, or registered in a very different area. Eric offers a baptism each for Sarah and Edward, but I cannot find a registration anywhere near. From the 1901 census, there is a registration for Richard Jones born Penygroes Carmarthenshire c. 1895, I found this which is 2 years away:
Richard Hopson . mmn Davies . Apr-Jun 1887 . Llandilofawr . Volume 11a . Page 936

Again, from the 1901 census, I think Richard Edwards was the son of Rebecca Boswell and Evan Edwards. He would be a cousin of William Boswell.
Marriage Banns:  Richard Edwards . Susan Jones . 30 July 1899 . Llanfihangel-yng-ngwynfa, Montgomeryshire
Susannah Edwards who was a Jones on the census, could be this registration as location matches census and Eric’s list:
Susannah Hopson . mmn Davies . Oct-Dec 1883 . Rhayader . Volume 11b . Page 124
Between the census records and Eric’s list, the birth years can change considerably.

There is also a link to William and Annie Boswell nee. Williams, who were witnesses at the marriage.
William Boswell (b.1865) is also listed in the same book.
His parents were Israel (William) Boswell (b.1840) and Elinor Williams.
Israel’s parents were Richard Boswell and Catherine Evans
Catherine Evans was the daughter of Daniel and Lydia Evans.

Israel also had a daughter called Catherine Ann(e) Boswell (b.3 Jul 1872)
She married Daniel Evans, the son of Edwin Evans and Subie Lee
Both Daniel Evans and William Boswell were showmen at fairs, or amusement caterers. Edwin was a basket-maker. There are plenty of articles for each of them, mainly court appearances.

Edward Evans died 1997 with date of birth 25 May 1923.
On the GRO for that quarter, there are only four births registered in Wales, but none without a second or third name. The birth could have been registered later, when this registration is a strong contender:
Edward Evans . mmn / . Jul-Sep 1923 . Aberayron . Volume 11b . Page 61
The certificate will give his mother’s name, though maybe not the father, as with no mmn he could be illegitimate.

Offline Natalieaevans1979

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Re: Evans hopson Hobson familys
« Reply #23 on: Sunday 29 May 22 18:33 BST (UK) »
Wow you have given me so much to get on with.  Many many thanks x

Offline Talacharn

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Re: Evans hopson Hobson familys
« Reply #24 on: Sunday 29 May 22 18:51 BST (UK) »
I have been looking for certain traveller families for several years, but trying to make sense of these relationships is quite a challenge; though most are, as they did not like authority and gave false or misleading information. The name Evans interested me, but the Boswells being witnesses made me want to dig a little.

What is the connection with William and Annie Boswell?
They would not attend a wedding; and be witnesses, unless related, or very close in some way.
It may be worth buying the birth certificate for Edward Evans. If it is correct, who was his mother, and if an Evans, was she related to Daniel and Lydia Evans? It would explain the travelling life.
When the lineage goes back to Boswell along with Daniel and Lydia Evans, they are important traveller families in Wales.

Offline Natalieaevans1979

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Re: Evans hopson Hobson familys
« Reply #25 on: Sunday 29 May 22 20:06 BST (UK) »
Edward evans is my grandfather (not that I knew him) there is a ? About whether his father was John evans and mother Mary thornley. But this is speculation.

Offline Talacharn

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Re: Evans hopson Hobson familys
« Reply #26 on: Sunday 29 May 22 21:18 BST (UK) »
Edward Evans . mmn Thornley . Jul-Sep 1923 . Merthyr T . Volume 11a . Page 1417

Added: There are marriages between Evans and Thornley, but none in Wales. They are Salford 1906, Bolton 1911, Northampton 1919 and West Derby 1921. The closest to his birth is Samuel Evans and Ellen Thornley Oct-Dec 1921 . W.Derby . Volume 8b . Page 764. But it is not known if he was the eldest.

Added #2: There is nothing for John and Mary. Were they actually married? With family rumours, when Thornley is not that common a name, to find a registration with it as an mmn, the certificate may be worth buying to see his parents.