John Stewart Married Grizel Farquahson 1822 Dull Perthshire.

[markwillcocks]

Hi,
We have been researching my wifes family history and found her 3x great grandfather John Stewart was born in 1823 in Grantully Perthshire (he gives his place of birth as Grantully in the 1851 Census) his Baptism record from Scotlands People only says Baptisms in Dull and the wording is... John the son of John Stewart and Grizel Farquahrson in Pitcairn was Baptized Dec 22nd (His parents John and Grizel were married in Dull 1822)
We know there were a few pitcains in the area, but St Marys church Grantully was in Nether Pitcain and we feel John was probably Baptized there.
What we are asking is because we can't confirm birth dates and locations for his parents John and Grizel we can't go back any further than we have and would be very interested to find out if John was a decendant of the Stewarts of Gantully or from somewhere else.
Is anyone else researching the Stewarts of Gantully or even the John Stewart we are researching ?

Thank you all

[GR2]

Have you found his parents in the 1841 or 1851 census? If they died after 1854, there will be a statutory death certificate for them which will take you back a further generation.

One thing to note is that Grizel may appear later on as Grace, in the same way that Isabels turned into Isabellas in the course of the 19th century.

[Forfarian]

The parish boundaries around Grandtully are extremely convoluted, with small detached parts of several parishes close by - Dull, Weem, Little Dunkeld and Logierait.

According to Fullarton's Gazetteer (1842) Grandtully is a district partly in Dull and partly in Little Dunkeld, so there is no conflict between Grandtully in one record and Dull in another.

Upper and Nether Pitcairn are both in the Dull part, so again there is no conflict of places.

If the witnesses to John's baptism were 'the congregation' then he was indeed baptised in the church, and if the day of baptism was a Sunday, it's likely that he was baptised in the church, but otherwise probably not, as it was not unusual for a baptism to take place in the parents' home. 

John Stewart and Grizel Farquharson had four recorded children: John 1823, Alexander 1826; Margaret 1828; Grizel 1833; all baptised in Dull. You can and should look at the originals of these baptisms to see if they list the names of witnesses who could be clues to family relationships.

In the 1851 census there is a household at 179 South Street, Perth, comprising John Stewart, 55; Grace Stewart, 55; Margaret Stewart, 22; and Grace Stewart, 17; all born in Dull. The given names Grace and Grizel were used interchangeably in Scotland, so these are your John's parents and sisters. In 1841 they were in the village of Guildtown in the parish of St Martin's, but that listing doesn't provide any extra information.

In 1861 John Stewart, 62, and his wife Grace F Stewart, 62, both born Dull, are in High Street, Perth. There should, therefore, be death certificates for both, which should tell you the names of their parents, assuming that the informant knew this, of course.

It won't have escaped you that they were a bit inconsistent with their ages. Age 55 in 1851 implies a birth in 1795/1796, and age 62 in 1861 implies 1798/1799, therefore at least one of these pairs of ages is wrong. (In 1841 they said they were 40. Adults' ages in 1841 were supposed to be rounded down to the nearest 5 years, so that implies that they were born between 1796 and 1801.)

Grace Stewart or Fairley, mother's maiden surname Farquharson, died in Glasgow in 1895 aged 62. This might be your John's sister.

The originals of all this information are available to view at www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk at modest cost.

[markwillcocks]

Thank you very much for replies they are very helpful and informative.
I managed to find a Grace Stewart who died in a Poorhouse up near Blair Atholl in 1871 and her parents were John Farquhason and Margaret Farquharson (Menzies) and she was the Widow of John Stewsrt but her age is given as 84, could this be wrong ?
And if she is our Johns wife it would indicate he died before 1871 and after 1861.
Thanks again

Mark

[Forfarian]

Yes, that could be your Grace in spite of the age - it's not uncommon for the poorhouse authorities to get people's ages wrong.

Wonder why she was at Blair Atholl? She had been long enough in Perth to be entitled to be looked after by the authorities there. Might be worth asking Perth and Kinross Archives if the have any relevant parochial board records. https://www.culturepk.org.uk/archive-local-family-history/ is the place to start.

[markwillcocks]

Well i might have made some progress thanks to the tips from you both.
I revisited a few death certificates i got from Scotlands People (at one stage i downloaded about 6 i thought might have been our John but to no avail)
Anyway i went back to the 1861 census where they were in High st Perth and cross referenced that with the death certificates and found the death of John Stewart at High st Perth in 1862 age 64, Parents John Stewart and Grace Scott.
The only problem with it was his wife was given as Grace Ferguson.
His son in law Patrick Flynn was the informant so i tried to link his marriage to one of Johns daughters and it turned out he married Margaret who in the 1871 census as Patricks wife gives her age as about 40 and her birth place as Grantully.
It all matches up except Johns wife being given as Ferguson but a quick check on Patrick and i found he was born in County Mayo Ireland.
Could his accent have confused the registrar with the names Farquharson and Ferguson

[GR2]

Could his accent have confused the registrar with the names Farquharson and Ferguson

Quite possibly, if all the other details point to it being the correct John Stewart.

The way to be certain is to get the marriage certificate of Patrick Flynn and Margaret Stewart. They married in Perth in 1862.

Margaret died in Perth in 1901, aged 66.

[Forfarian]

John Stewart and Grace Scott had
Alexander 1793
James 1794
James 1795
John 1797
all in Dull.

There's also an earlier one, Grisel in 1775.

However there are two marriages of a John Stewart to Gr* Scot* - one in Dowally in 1771 and one in Dull in 1781. So the first one would account for the 1775 baptism.

That's a long gap between the marriage in 1781 and the first recorded baptism in 1793.

[markwillcocks]

Thanks again for your help.
Well i just purchased another 30 credits for Scotlands People and it paid off.
In the marriage certificate for Margaret and Patrick,  Margaret put her mothers name as Grace Stewart (Farquharson)
So that makes Johns death certificate correct and his wife Grace Ferguson is actually Grace Farquharson.

Well now on to trying to trace John Stewart and Grace Scott.

With us living in Australia it makes it a bit harder but the internet serves us well.
If we were over there we could probably just go down to the records office.

Thanks again