Author Topic: HUMPHRIES Elizabeth Sarah (or Sophia?) Brighton 1856/7/8?  (Read 1918 times)

Offline jonw65

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Re: HUMPHRIES Elizabeth Sarah (or Sophia?) Brighton 1856/7/8?
« Reply #9 on: Friday 02 September 22 23:01 BST (UK) »
Any assistance appreciated. TCS.

Perhaps you need to elaborate on who/what/why

Offline Annette7

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Re: HUMPHRIES Elizabeth Sarah (or Sophia?) Brighton 1856/7/8?
« Reply #10 on: Saturday 03 September 22 04:16 BST (UK) »
In 1861 the family John is with in Ringmer in 1871 - Thomas and Frances Naomi Potter (nee Toogood) - are in Brighton although Thomas is shown as Joseph!!   However, they have a dau. Eliza Potter aged 2 born Brighton who actually appears to be Ellen Elizabeth birth Dec.qtr.1858 Brighton - mmn Toogood and after her is a 'son' Joseph Potter aged 4 also born Brighton.   I'm wondering if this 'Joseph' is in fact your John Humphries.   John is listed as Potter in 1871 and more to the point, there is no Joseph Potter mmn Toogood ca.1857 Brighton or under Toogood hence me wondering if this could in fact be your John.

Annette     
Scopes (One-Name Study - Worldwide)
Suffolk - Grist, Knights, Bullenthorpe, Watcham
Scotland - Spence, Horne, Cowan, Moffat
London -  Monk

Don't walk behind me, I may not lead.   Don't walk in front of me, I may not follow.   Just walk beside me and be my friend.

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Offline jonw65

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Re: HUMPHRIES Elizabeth Sarah (or Sophia?) Brighton 1856/7/8?
« Reply #11 on: Saturday 03 September 22 07:45 BST (UK) »
There is this birth reg, is it the right one?
HUMPHRIES, JOHN  LAING     
Mother's Maiden Surname: —
GRO Reference: 1857  J Quarter in BRIGHTON  Volume 02B  Page 199

Still not had an answer to this question.
If it is, and you have the certificate, please give all the information on it. There are quite a number of Elizabeth Humph* in Brighton, and elsewhere in Sussex.

Offline jonw65

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Re: HUMPHRIES Elizabeth Sarah (or Sophia?) Brighton 1856/7/8?
« Reply #12 on: Saturday 03 September 22 12:25 BST (UK) »
Re the Potters.
Thomas and Frances Naomi Potter married 17 July 1856, Forest Row, East Grinstead.
Thomas was a Butler.

They have a daughter, Catherine Jane, baptized there, 4 Jan 1857.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HT-69C9-1K2

Then Ellen Elizabeth was baptized 9 January 1859, St. Peter Brighton
Abode Grosvenor Street
Father a Servant
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-D41S-61D

Perhaps Thomas Potter and Elizabeth Humphries were in service together? Or was John with the Potters in Grosvenor Street by March 1858?

Then at Ringmer, 12 Oct 1862
Henry Humphrey's(!)
Parents Thomas and Frances Naomi Potter
Abode Ringmer
Father a Servant
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-6X19-KDS

POTTER, HENRY  HUMPHREY     
Mother's Maiden Surname: TOOGOOD 
GRO Reference: 1862  M Quarter in LEWES  Volume 02B  Page 147

He is Henry Humphris Potter, 9, in Ringmer in 1871
Bearing the same middle name as John, 14.
A bit strange!



Offline TimCSS

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Re: HUMPHRIES Elizabeth Sarah (or Sophia?) Brighton 1856/7/8?
« Reply #13 on: Saturday 03 September 22 12:52 BST (UK) »
I started to reply to all your responses to my Humphries enquiry last night but somehow lost it all!
Jonw65. Yes, we have John Laing Humphries, born Brighton 1857, my wife's Gt Grandfather. The address given
was a 'lodging house' just off Brighton Sea Front. I do have the certificate. Father's name not given although we do know all about him.
Annette7. Yes, John Humphries was 'farmed out' to live with the Potter family firstly in Brighton and later Ringmer with John Body. Shown as John 'Humphris' Potter. Most of that family in Ringmer churchyard now but one married and went to USA. A letter from her exists. John Body was a'Fly Operator', the minicab of the day.
JonW65. Unfortunately no connection with the coal dealer. Elizabeth Sophia's father was a publican.
I crossed the George & Elizabeth Humphreys off the list some time ago.
John Laing Humphries married Amelia Waters at St Margarets church Horsmonden a couple of miles from where we live. The Waters family had shops in several Kent towns. John Laing Humphries first shop was in St James Street Brighton. The baptism at St Nicholas church Brighton is not connected. (Another of those Red Herrings!) The 1858 baptism at St Peters is John although mother's middle name is given as Sarah and name spelt 'Humphreys'.
Lewis John Laing Humphries was elder brother to Ernest who was my wife's Grandfather. Lewis had a motor car repair garage in Lewes Sussex. Ernest had general stores and shops as did his father.
GirlGuide. Elizabeth Sophia was born in Lambeth where her father John Terry Humphries had a pub. Baptised December 1833. Believe two brothers of Elizabeth Sophia, William Robert and James Frederick.
Your latest came in whilst I was writing: Yes that's right. They later moved to Brighton and then Ringmer. Thomas Potter's father had a pub at Bramber in Sussex. His brother Walter was the famous Victorian taxidermist.
CaroleW & Kiltaglassan: As you both see this has been a 'on-going' project. Thanks for your interest.
I think that covers most of it so far. Thank You all.

Offline TimCSS

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Re: HUMPHRIES Elizabeth Sarah (or Sophia?) Brighton 1856/7/8?
« Reply #14 on: Saturday 03 September 22 13:01 BST (UK) »
JonW; Just read your latest; Most of that is correct.  Still digging into Grosvenor Street. Demolished long time ago! Henry Humphris Potter died young, got the date somewhere. He's in Ringmer churchyard as well.

Offline Annette7

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Re: HUMPHRIES Elizabeth Sarah (or Sophia?) Brighton 1856/7/8?
« Reply #15 on: Saturday 03 September 22 14:17 BST (UK) »
I'm getting confused - where does the second name 'Sophia' suddenly come from, and why have you now rejected that George and Elizabeth were her parents?   You say now her father was a publican?   How do you know that?

How is she named on John's birth certificate - Elizabeth Sarah, Elizbeth Sophia or just plain Elizabeth?   As you say, on baptism she is Elizabeth Sarah - at a time when most of the working class couldn't read or write names were just written as they sounded to the relevant recorder of an event so change between Humphries to Humphreys is quite common.

Annette
Scopes (One-Name Study - Worldwide)
Suffolk - Grist, Knights, Bullenthorpe, Watcham
Scotland - Spence, Horne, Cowan, Moffat
London -  Monk

Don't walk behind me, I may not lead.   Don't walk in front of me, I may not follow.   Just walk beside me and be my friend.

Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline TimCSS

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Re: HUMPHRIES Elizabeth Sarah (or Sophia?) Brighton 1856/7/8?
« Reply #16 on: Saturday 03 September 22 15:52 BST (UK) »
Annette: Yes, all confusing isn't it! When this started out it confused us as well.
We have positively discounted the Elizabeth SARAH Humphries baptised at St Nicholas Brighton daughter of George & Elizabeth as that family appear not to have had any later connections to Brighton. So put them to one side for the time being.
Elizabeth SOPHIA Humphries; Her father was a publican John Terry Humphries in Lambeth London. Her mother Sarah (ms Walesby) was his second wife.
Details from birth certificate of John Laing HUMPHRIES;
Registration District, BRIGHTON, The Palace, County of Sussex. No 31. 11th April 1857, 24 Oriental Place. Sex, Boy. Mother's Name, Elizabeth Sarah Humphries. Signature, description and residence of informant, John Laing, occupier, 24 Oriental Place, Brighton. When Registered, Twentyfirst April 1857. George Smith, Registrar.
24 Oriental Place was a good class lodging house often used by John Laing's brother the Reverend David Laing when staying or preaching in Brighton. He was responsible for building Holy Trinity church at Haverstock Hill in west London.
We presume that John Laing did not know Elizabeth's second name or was confused at the time he registered the birth. He later married a woman whose name was Sarah. (his second wife) Or maybe the name Sarah was used to confuse other people including us! Perhaps the registrar was hard of hearing, who knows? Yes, people did spell phonetically.

Offline Little Nell

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Re: HUMPHRIES Elizabeth Sarah (or Sophia?) Brighton 1856/7/8?
« Reply #17 on: Saturday 03 September 22 17:01 BST (UK) »
I am very confused.  Am I reading your post correctly or have I misunderstood something?

Quote
Elizabeth SOPHIA Humphries; Her father was a publican John Terry Humphries in Lambeth London. Her mother Sarah (ms Walesby) was his second wife.

May I ask what proof you have that Elizabeth Sarah/Sophia's father was a publican.  I thought you said that you did not have any details of her birth or death.

With regard to John Laing Humphries birth registration, how was the informant John Laing described - just present at the birth? Anything else apart from occupier of the lodging house?  You also said that you know all about John Laing Humphries father - who was he?  You haven't actually given his name, or was it John Laing?  Again, may I ask what is the proof of that?

Nell
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