James Phipps, Sussex and London

[DianaCanada]

James Phipps was baptized 12 Dec 1813 in Heathfield, Sussex, the son of William Phipps and Elizabeth Potten.  (I have an earlier query about this nephew James who joined the Navy.)
I have found three sons for William and Elizabeth, baptized in Heathfield.  I have been working on the second son John's family (b. 1816) but no success with William (b. 1819).

At some point the family moved to London, and in 1841 William and Elizabeth Phipps are living in Chelsea. 

In 1861 I found the two older sons, John and James, living next door to each other in Hampstead.  James is with wife Sarah and three or four stepchildren, surname Anderson.  I found his marriage to Sarah on Ancestry, 1858, she was born Sarah Ann Turner.  She was a widow, James a widower.

I cannot find James on the 1841 or 1851 censuses.  Could not find a marriage on Ancestry or FamilySearch.  I can't find him in British military records. 

Sarah is widowed by 1871.  There is a possible death in Hampstead in 1870 for James, age is 50, should be 56, but might be a transcription error with the 6 looking like a zero.

I've checked newspapers for his death and also the probate index, nothing found.

I can't think of any other ways to find him, but maybe I've missed something.  Any help appreciated!

[Daisypetal]

Hi,

This could be James attestation to the Royal Marines, it would explain why he can't be found in 1841 or 1851,

https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/C10104768


Regards,
Daisy

[Daisypetal]

A possible first marriage for James,

James PHIPPS    Dec Q  1850    Fareham    07  173
Rebecca MARSH on same page.


17 Nov 1850
St Mary the Virgin, Rowner, Hampshire

James PHIPPS
Of full age
Bachelor
Private of the Royal Marines
Residence:  H.M.S. Victory
Father:  William PHIPPS,  labourer

Rebecca MARSH
A minor with consent of parents.
Spinster
Residence:  Rowner
Father:  George MARSH,  labourer

Witnesses:  Jeremiah and Charlotte GALBIN
Only James signed his name.



There is a death of a Rebecca PHIPPS which might be her,

Rebecca PHIPPS    Sep Q 1851    Alverstoke    07  15
Age:  20 

Burial
22 July 1851
St Thomas, Parish of Alverstoke, Elson District, Hampshire
Rebecca PHIPPS
Residence:  Brockhurst
Age:  20


Daisy

[DianaCanada]

Thank you, Daisy, this certainly looks like it might be James.  I guess the file can only be seen at the Archives?  The marriage matches up, very sad about Rebecca's early death.
I think she is the Rebecca Phipps found on the 1851, right age, b. Rowner, Hamphire, as a R. Marine's wife, living in Brockhurst with a family named Ridley.

[Girl Guide]

I had a quick look at the British Royal Navy Allotment Declarations for 1841 and 1851.

The 1841 image shows his mother's name as Elizabeth and as far as I can tell the address is 17 Little North Place or Street, Portman Market.

The 1851 image shows his wife as Rebecca, James was a Private 1st Class and the vessel was Victory. The address appeared to be Bridgemary?, near Brockhurst, Gosport. The marriage date is mentioned but you have that already from Daisypetal.

[DianaCanada]

Girl Guide, thank you.  My James’ mother was indeed Elizabeth, and in 1841 she and her husband were living on North Street, Chelsea.  Portman Market is described online as being in Marylebone, near Paddington.  Is these all in the same area?

[Kay99]

If it helps this is Portman Market near Paddington https://maps.nls.uk/view/103312991#zoom=6&lat=1414&lon=10832&layers=BT  Will have a look for North Street

Kay

Added - there is a North Street on the same map but not sure it is the right one    More likely that is was in Hans Town as mentioned here https://hidden-london.com/gazetteer/hans-town/  and now known as Basil Street https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Basil_Street

[ShaunJ]

The 1841 image shows his mother's name as Elizabeth and as far as I can tell the address is 17 Little North Place or Street, Portman Market.

That's been written over a previous address in "Chard, Somersetshire". The amendment may have been made after 1841.

[Daisypetal]

Hi,

The address in "British Royal Navy Allotment Declarations" found by Girl Guide is 17 Little North Street, there is a Little North Street on the map found by Kay, it's just under North Street. It looks like it's an estate now,

https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/side-by-side/#zoom=17.3&lat=51.52427&lon=-0.17133&layers=168&right=osm



But the 1841 address for William and Elizabeth is 39 North Street, in Chelsea which looks like the one found by Kay,

https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/side-by-side/#zoom=17.6&lat=51.50073&lon=-0.16054&layers=250&right=osm



I've looked through Little North Street in the 1841 census (no numbers are written on it), I can't find  Elizabeth PHIPPS there but I did find this PHIPPS family,

1841  North Street, Little, St Marylebone
PHIPPS
Thomas  40  Bricklayer
Mary    40
Mary    18
Fredk    14
Edwd     7

They are sharing with a Thomas WHITE and family, they all say born in Middlesex.

This PHIPPS family are still there in 1851, minus daughter Mary, and Thomas says he was born in Herts.

 
I wonder if Elizabeth could have been staying there at some time in 1841?


It's quite a coincidence "North Street" and "Little North Street" isn't it, very confusing.


Daisy