Author Topic: What position in a bakers is a "Bread Forehand"?  (Read 661 times)

Offline Annbee

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Re: What position in a bakers is a "Bread Forehand"?
« Reply #9 on: Sunday 29 January 23 01:12 GMT (UK) »
Hello Maddys52,

I read about the Scots in an article written in the 1840s, so not exactly the 70s. "The great majority of the bakers are from Scotland, a large number from Devonshire, and several from the other western counties: a few from Ireland. Scotland is the great nursery of bakers. The master bakers in Scotland and the western counties of England are in the habit of employing only apprentices, who are dismissed as soon as they are out of their time, and are thrown on the English labour-market."

Also from another article, from 1860, on the same page "In Scotland the journeymen bakers shook off their yoke some years since. The result has been eminently satisfactory. Rescued from the system by which they were crushed and goaded into habits of intemperance, they have since - as in the case of the Factory Operatives under the Ten Hours' Act, and other classes in similar circumstances - rapidly risen in the social scale, while the interests of the masters, so far from having been prejudiced by the change, have been greatly promoted by means of it...

The desire is to carry out a similar social reform in the case of the Metropolis to what has been state to have been done in Scotland, by abolishing night-work, and restricting the period of labour to 12 hours per day, inclusive of meal time. That is to say, in lieu of the men working from 11 p.m. to 3 or 4 o'clock the following day, subject o the short respites already described, it is proposed that they shall commence their labours at 4 a.m., and work continuously on, with the exception of meal time, till 4 p.m., and then finish...

I find that the only actual obstacle in the way of their commencing work at the more reasonable hour of 5.30a.m. or 6 a.m., is the demand on the part of the public for hot rolls for breakfast. Now I cannot believe but that families will relinquish this most unwholesome indulgence when they learn that by so doing they will so materially conduce to the comfort and welfare of some ten or twelve thousand human beings (speaking of London alone), who hitherto have suffered so grievously, and yet so submissively, in ministering to their enjoyment."

Re the latter 2 paragraphs, written in 1860, boy, was that writer dreamin'! My father rose at 2-3am most of his life and even though he was the employer he pitched in with his bakers. The bakers knocked off mid morning and my father continued working on until at least 4pm. That went on until mid 1980s.

I guess real stats weren't collected comprehensively in those days so whatever is written are probably verge on opinion pieces rather than fact.

Still. We haven't got a lot else to go on!

This is the page link to my excerpts: https://www.victorianlondon.org/professions/bakers.htm

Another thought now is that Scotch forehand might be the 'union' man, the man representing and overseeing the working conditions of his colleagues. As we know, Scots are known for unionism and speaking up for the rights of workers.

I am half Scottish, so everything I write on this subject is biased.

Do you think if we tracked down a 100 year old baker in a nursing home, we'd find an answer? :)

Warwickshire: BEACH/BACHE, COX Gloucestershire: HAIL, VOYCE, TURNER, WINCHCOMBE, PREEN, Worcestershire: WEBB, CHARE, TYLER, Fife: FOWLER, JOHNSTONE, MELVILLE, Lanarkshire/Dunbartonshire: GRAHAM, CHALMERS, LANG, BISHOP, Sweden/Hamburg/London/Birmingham: HOKANSON

Offline Annbee

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Re: What position in a bakers is a "Bread Forehand"?
« Reply #10 on: Sunday 29 January 23 01:37 GMT (UK) »
Quote
Reading about the conditions in bakeries at the time it seems a wonder that anyone would want to join, or stay in the trade!

Well, I guess many employed bakers leave the trade, even today because of the dreadful hours. Then again, shift work these days pays well.

But I thought you might like to know my family's crede in the older days - apart from what was real pride in the goods they made - that it was you can't go wrong with a baking business. No matter how bad the social circumstances in the country (depression, war, poverty), a loaf of bread was the lowest common denominator in every household.

My baking ancestors came to this conclusion after having had a catastrophic end to their highly successful merchant business in Birmingham called Beach and Minte. In the 1880s, the downturn in the jewellery trade and what seems to be business fraud by an overseas partner cause a much publicised bankruptcy.

I figure that made the business of bread very attractive!





 
Warwickshire: BEACH/BACHE, COX Gloucestershire: HAIL, VOYCE, TURNER, WINCHCOMBE, PREEN, Worcestershire: WEBB, CHARE, TYLER, Fife: FOWLER, JOHNSTONE, MELVILLE, Lanarkshire/Dunbartonshire: GRAHAM, CHALMERS, LANG, BISHOP, Sweden/Hamburg/London/Birmingham: HOKANSON