John & Ann (Ashton) Williams Death Records

[McFab]

I’m researching my wife’s family history which I’ve been doing for some time. Unfortunately it appears to be a name where there’s a lot of information about her early life and not much on her later life, mainly her death. This also appears to be the same for her husband John.

This is what I have:
Mary Ann (Anne) Ashton
Born:   1818 Chatham, Kent
Baptised:    Sept, 1818
Married:    John Williams – Oct 1839
Children:    I have 5 – 3 sons & 2 daughters
Death:       ?

John Williams
Born:   1811 Hobart Town
Baptised:  Jan 1812
Married:   Ann Ashton – Oct 1839
Children:   I have 5 – 3 sons & 2 daughters
Death:   ?

Ann Elizabeth, their last child was born in 1856, John was a “Cooper” and they lived in Melville Street.

I have the following Information;
Ann was a witness in October 1872 when Ann Elizabeth married Benjamin Broad
Ann (Grandmother) Williams has signed as an Informant on Benjamin John Broad’s birth record in April 1877
Possible - Anne Williams – Died 4th Dec, 1889 Murray Street aged 74 years (Born 1815) Cornelian Bay Cemetery

John’s name is on the birth record of Ann Elizabeth Oct, 1856, but her mother Ann signed
Possible – John Williams, buried 23rd April 1890 died a “pauper” (Born 1811) Cornelian Bay Cemetery

What makes it harder with John’s record is, there is a convict John Williams who has the same birth year.

If anybody has any information that could help resolve the deaths of both John & Ann (Ashton) Williams, it would be very much appreciated.

I’m possibly not the first and more than likely not the last to seek closure on both these deaths.

Regards
McFab

[matthewj64]

Possible - Anne Williams – Died 4th Dec, 1889 Murray Street aged 74 years (Born 1815) Cornelian Bay Cemetery

Anne's burial is the reopening of the grave of Tudor Williams who was buried the same year
https://server2.admin.millingtons.com.au:81/ASP/search_details.asp?RecordID=7466
https://server2.admin.millingtons.com.au:81/ASP/search_details.asp?RecordID=7273
https://stors.tas.gov.au/AF70-1-15P436JPG
https://stors.tas.gov.au/AF70-1-15P228JPG

...son of the late C B Williams esq of Bristol
https://trove.nla.gov.au/newspaper/article/9215688

M

[McFab]

matthewj64, from what I take of your reply the Anne Williams burial records I found are for a separate family and Tudor Williams mother?

Thank very much for your quick reply
McFab

[shume]

The Tasmanian Archives has Ann(e) Williams of Murray Street, Hobart on Dec 4th 1889 as a widow.

From the info you have given about witnessing family births etc, it would seem that Ann (ex convict) has survived her husband John. However, if he did die in 1890 of  senile debility he could have been in the Pauper's establishment for several years prior to death ( possibly dementia?)

The death of another John Williams (convict) born England has his birth as 1821, not 1811 as per Findagrave. in 1890

[wivenhoe]

"there’s a lot of information about her early life "

What information do you have about her early life?.

Might have a clue to her later life and death.

[McFab]

Wivenhoe, our right, there is a lot on information out there and a lot of individual’s researching her. Ann or some have her as Anne, like many early female convicts she is the foundation of an expansive family and heavily researched.

I’ve been researching her now for a few years and I am the first to admit I’m not good at it, but the area around Ann and her husband John’s death and burial records is very important to my wife’s family history.

I have asked for and received extremely valuable hints/help over the years from a lot of very knowledgeable individuals like yourself not only on the Williams side of the family but on my side as well.

Anyway, getting back to Ann and John I would be extremely grateful if you could pass on any information on Ann and John's deaths or burials, it would be very much appreciated. As you mention in your reply, Ann is heavily researched but there appears to be no factual dates that can be backed up by sold evidence, (or at least what I can find) of where and how they died and where they were buried.

Regards
McFab

[McFab]

shume, thank you very much for your input. Although I included the 1889 death I now have some concerns around the record showing her being born in Cumberland, England where Ann Ashton (to the best of my knowledge) was born in Chatham, the other thing I have picked up on is the last address I have for John & Ann is Melville Street in 1856 and the 1889 death shows Murray Street. At this point in time I haven't found a family member who lived in Murray Street, not that that is a deal breaker.
Thank you again.
McFab

[wivenhoe]

Using....Linc ...name search - finds

Ann ASHTON.......Permission to marry.  Ann ASHTON arrived on the "Atwick" ....husband John WILLIAMS is ...free

  21 Oct 1839  St Davids Hobart
WILLIAMS John   26 years   cooper   bachelor    (X)
ASHTON Ann      20 years                spinster     (X)

in the presence of R * FOREMAN      Charlotte HANSON  (X)

(...my note - R I FOREMAN and HANSON have been written again above the original writing. I think the original initials for FOREMAN were R J)

Convict records for Ann ASHTON on the LINC site are -
CON40/1/12 
*   arrived "Atwick"  24 Jan 1838
*   tried Edinburgh Crt of Justy  14 March 1837
*   "theft by housebreaking and previous...."

CON19/1/12  page 172   (it is image 179)
Ann ASHTON housemaid  age 18

written on the entry is -

Chatham     bro up at Cannongate Edinbro

I read this to mean Ann was brought before the court in Edinburgh Scotland. If Chatham is recorded to be her native place I might expect to see at least...England...to also be added.  I think this records Ann to be from/native of Chatham in Kent. The CON40 record includes previous offences, and three years on the town, a reference to prostitution.

Ann must have been in Scotland/Edinburgh for several years before her conviction in 1837, so there might be English-born ASHTONs in Edinburgh in the 1841 Scotland census...Ann's family.

On the "Atwick", and convicted in the same Edinburgh Court of Justiciary, same date 14 March 1837, are Ann SUTHERLAND and Elizabeth HOUSTON.

Use britishnewspaperarchives.com   
Select...Scotland......1837....March 16
Finds.....Caledonian Mercury....Ann SUTHERLAND....and other convictions -

" Ann Sutherland, charged atith various acts of theft, aggravated by her previous conviction, pleaded Guilty, T anid was Eentenced to transportation for seven years. Heenry Wade, charged with theft. aggravated ..."

I am pasting what is visible, and in garbled form, at a pay-to-view website.

You need to create an account, and pay to see the entire article about court proceedings for that day, which I am sure will name Ann ASHTON.

[sparrett]

Adds a couple more details about her.
https://www.scottishindexes.com/adentry.aspx?adid=837244
Sue