Coote – Northwold, Norfolk – 1780 to 1810

[MaecW]

From the Parish records I have five children born between 1798 and 1810 and given as the children of Joseph and Ann Coote. The vicar was one of those lovely men who included the mother's maiden name, in this case “late Hewen”. My problem is that I have been unable to find a marriage for this couple.  I have checked Ancestry, Family Search, and FindMyPast.
There is a Marriage Bond between Joseph Coote, a farmer and singleman, aged 50 of Northwold, and an Ann Hearsign, widow aged 42,  at Burgate in Suffolk on 20th or 27th July 1782. (records disagree !) Whilst, at first glance and allowing for the usual problems with pronunciation, this looks promising, Ann's age would suggest she is not the Ann Hewen who produced children from 1798 onwards.
I have not been able to find a likely marriage for Ann Hewen.

Given that “Joseph Coote” (or Coot) is a relatively common name throughout East Anglia can anybody  either identify this couple or point me at other possible sources.

[Ili1133]

Joseph Coote of Northwold m Jane Hewen otp at Methwold, 29 March 1798, by licence (corrected: my apologies, Yokel, you’re quite right)

Joseph signed, the bride used her mark. It’s difficult to distinguish the entry from the mark, but it may read Ann Jane Hewen. Looks as if she was baptized Jane in 1771, d of Edward and Jane.

[The Yokel]

There is a marriage bond also

https://nrocatalogue.norfolk.gov.uk/index.php/marriage-licence-bond-joseph-coote-and-jane-hewen

[trish1120]

FreeREG has 6 children to Joseph/Ann nee Hewen
Mary 1798
Elizabeth 1799, bapt 1800
Jane 1802
Edward 1803
Joseph 1808, (Father Joseph/Mother as Mary Hewen)
William 1810

There is also a Burial of JOHN Coote, Infant, 24 Feb 1814, Son of JOSEPH/JANE

Other Burials;
MARY Coot 14 Apr 1779, Wife of Joseph a Farmer
MARY Coot 22 May 1790  age 20, Consumption, Daug of Joseph a Farmer
JOSEPH Coote 9 Apr 1795, age 64, decline, Farmer

So Josephs Parents and Sister I would say

+ Joseph and his Wife;
JANE Coote 04 May 1843 age 71 (c 1772)
JOSEPH Coote 20 May 1817 age 52

[trish1120]

Edward HEWIN married Jane FLATT 9 May 1757, St George, Methwold

[The Yokel]

The Marriage bond and marriage are on Family Search

https://www.rootschat.com/links/01s61/   ........Image 463 and 464

https://www.rootschat.com/links/01s62/

https://www.rootschat.com/links/01s63/

[MaecW]

Thank you all for your replies.

Unfortunately, and I may not have made myself clear, I already have most of the information you have offered. What I am trying to establish is : Is the Ann Coote, nee Hewen, given as the mother of the six children (I had missed Jane !) born between 1798 and 1810  in Northwold the same person as the Jane Hewen who married a Joseph Coote in Methwold in 1798 ?
Apart from the mark on the Methwold marriage record which lli1133 has noted and which could read “ann” but might also be Jane's “Mark”, there seems to be no evidence that these are the same person. If “Ann” was a family or pet name for Jane it seems odd that the Vicar used the name in the Baptismal records but not at the time of her burial in 1843, nor does it show on her gravestone.

I feel it would be wrong to just assume that Jane and Ann are the same person without some sort of confirming evidence.  Granted that the dates seem to fit but, as I said in my first post, there were several Joseph Coote around Norfolk/Suffolk at the time so a second pair is possible.

Ah ! The joys of Family History !

Maec

[Ili1133]

I sympathize with you as I have a great-great grandmother who was baptized Jane but was subsequently known as Ann. Without the 1839 marriage certificate where her father is named, it's impossible to confirm.

That said, looking at the problem from the Hewen perspective you have a number of pieces of supporting evidence that Jane/Ann are the same person:

     - Jane/Ann was baptized in Methwold but had children and died in the parish of Northwold, so the Northwold parish wouldn't have recorded her first name at birth and there was no strong reason they needed to question her choice of name (it looks as if Joseph Coote was quite a prosperous farmer so not a risk to the parish in terms of poor law)
     - Ann/Jane and Joseph named children Jane and Edward, Jane Hewen’s parents’ Christian names;
     - the Hewens were a long established farming family in Methwold and there is no sign of a daughter named Ann in the timeframe you're looking at, but Jane Coote’s death in 1843 at age 71 fits well with Jane Hewen’s baptism in 1771;
     - the Hewen and Coote families appear a lot in each other’s legal documents - as well as Joseph and Jane's marriage licence, William Hewen is a guarantor to Joseph Coote’s admon (1819) where his widow Jane is executrix.
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:3Q9M-CSN6-M96T-W?i=541&cat=291384.

The spelling of Hewen seems well established in legal circles and both families would be known across the two parishes as they were big farmers in the area, which persuades me that the baptism records of Ann/Jane’s surname are accurate.
 
From the Coote perspective, the other Joseph Coote of Northwold you mention appears to be the one whose death trish1120 flagged (marriage bond 1782/age 50, death 1795/age 64), so he couldn't be the father of the children born to Joseph and Ann from 1798 on. There don't appear to be any other Joseph Cootes in the area at that time, only further afield in Norfolk/Suffolk.

It's true this is circumstantial evidence but I can't find any strong counter evidence to suggest that there are two different Coote families involved. Maybe the name “Jane” came to reflect “Ann”’s status better as she matured?!

[MaecW]

Many thanks, lli,

I had missed the Admon, and allowed myself to get confused by the Cootes.

You have provided exactly the sort of argument I needed to accept the connection; in particular "the Hewen perspective" is pretty convincing. You gave some background there with reference to other legal documents which suggests you have access not available online ? Or is it just a question of knowing what to look for ?
I did discover the Baron Court records for the Manor of Hovell & Dagneys in Northwold covering this period but must admit that the script and formal language defeated me !
I also have photos of the gravestones of both Joseph and Jane from FindaGrave(?) but they are too encrusted to read clearly and I don't have the facility to "photoshop" them. If somebody could do this for me I would be most grateful.
Thank you again for your logical exposition.

Maec