Records Before 1800 -- Gibson

[resjes]

Hello All -

My relatives and I are trying to trace our ancestors back to Berwickshire. They moved to the United States (most went to New York then to Wisconsin) by 1840ish. One of my ancestors, Robert Gibson, was born in Berwickshire in 1817 and married Ellen Isabel Mahon(e?). Another ancestor on the opposite side is John Gibson, born in 1807 in Scotland and married Elisabeth Miller. Obviously it has become difficult to go farther back with such common names. Also, my great-grandmother had the same last name as her husband, Gibson, which adds to the difficulties. They were Presbyterians and married into families that bordered England, such as people from Northumberland (Northumbria?). We have all the records in the United States but can't get any earlier really...

Any suggestions to research online are greatly appreciated. I went to the Scotland archives website and the Presbyterian records are not available online.

TIA!

[Forfarian]

The vast majority of the surviving Scottish birth/baptism, banns/marriages and deaths (but not burials) are online at www.scotlandspeople.gov.uk.

Not sure why you think "the Presbyterian records are not available online", because they are.

The term presbyterian describes a system of church hierarchy, not a set of beliefs or doctrines. The Church of Scotland is presbyterian, and so are most of the breakaway denominations in Scotland.

It means that instead of a pyramid of clergy culminating in bishops and archbishops, a presbyterian denomination is organised in tiers of committees.

The bottom tier is the kirk session, which is the committee of ministers and elders that runs the affairs of an individual kirk or parish.

The next tier is the presbytery, which is a committee made up of the ministers and one representative elder from each kirk session in the presbytery's geographical area. Above the presbyteries are larger committees called synods, covering several presbyteries, and the top tier is the general assembly.

Scotland's People has all but a tiny handful of the surviving records of Church of Scotland parishes, and the bulk of the surviving records held by the National Records of Scotland of other denominations. These have been digitised and are available online. They are pay-per-view but modestly priced.

Northumberland is a historic county, the most northerly in England, including the city of Newcastle-upon-Tyne and the town of Berwick-upon-Tweed. In practical terms the records you are likely to want will be from Northumberland. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northumberland and https://www.genuki.org.uk/big/eng/NBL

Northumbria has two meanings. It can mean either an ancient kingdom that pre-dates the historic counties, and it is also the name given to a modern local government area that replaced Northumberland in the latter part of the 20th century. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northumbria_(disambiguation)

Realistically, you are not going to be able to home in on John Gibson, born 1807, without more information. For instance, did he marry Elizabeth Miller in Scotland? If so, there appear to be three records of interest. One in 1831 in Edrom, which is in Berwickshire, close to the English border, and one each in 1832 in Bervie and Arbuthnott. These parishes are close to one another in Kincardineshire so the likelihood is that this is one couple who, before their marriage, lived in different parishes. Their banns would have been proclaimed in both parishes, resulting in a double record of the same event.

One thing to be aware of is that the surviving records are far from comprehensive, so you must never assume that the only candidate who roughly matches your ancestor is necessarily the right one.

[Neale1961]

There is a GIBSON family tree here on FamilySearch. You would need to check the sources, but it may help you.

https://www.familysearch.org/tree/pedigree/landscape/LRF2-BG4

[resjes]

Thanks everyone for your help...

I think this person is an ancestor to me on my great-grandmother's side from what I can tell:

https://www.familysearch.org/tree/pedigree/landscape/9QYG-2PZ

I goofed up my great-grandfather's side. My great-grandmother is Jessie Ellen Gibson, and Johne Gibsone appears to be her greatxxxxx grandfather.

This is John Henry Gibson's side: https://www.familysearch.org/tree/pedigree/landscape/9977-SGY

Can't figure out how to fix his tree.

[squirejay]

Hi Resjes
Your Robert Gibson is a brother of my 2x Gr Grandfather, William Gibson born in 1821 and farmed with his brother Anderson a farm on the Coldingham area of Berwickshire called "Burnhall" in the 1861 and 1871 census

In Coldingham Priory Churchyard there is an obelisk to David Gibson and Isabella Renton with a number of their children's names also on the stone.

There is a branch of the Gibson's who farm in Alberta, north of Edmonton, they are descended from Anderson Gibson, 1856 to 1940, who was the son of Anderson Gibson 1818 to 1892. He emigrated with his family in 1907 onboard M.V. Sicilian from Glasgow. he died in Saskatchewan on 1st Dec 1940.
Any other details, please let me know, as  I have just picked this thread up after a time away from Rootschat.

regards
squirejay

[ciderdrinker]

Good Morning
Just a few things to add in case you don't have them
Baptism at the Scotch Church Berwick on Tweed(a Presbyterian church)
Robert Gibson  s of David a servant to Mr Weir a farmer at Goswick parish of Holy Island and Isabella his wife born Oct 3  1815 and baptised 28th Nov.

Siblings  John s of David junior born at Loch End Berwick 15h August 1807 and baptised 25th ,Alison born 17th March 1809 d of David husbandman od Steps of Grace Berwick and Isdabel bapt April 4th 1809 ,David 17.2.1811 born 27th January a labourer in Tweedmouth

It looks like they are on the 1841 census at High Cocklaw Cocklaw Bon Tweed
David 56 ag lab Scotland
Isabella 53
Anderson 20
William 20 Thomas 12
next door to Rentons
John Renton 45 ag lab
Margaret 40
John 15
Ann 18
Alison 10
George 7
Margaret5
Jean 2months.
In 1851 David is 67 born Cornhill Northumberland ,Isabella 63 Scotland

Marriages John Gibson and Elizabeth Miller 1 Sep 1832 Bervie /Arbuthnott or 8 April 1831 Edrom

So any idea where their children were born?
Parents George and Jane  in Arthbuthnott or William and Elizabeth nee Lyal at Edrom or possibly John Gibson son of David and Isabel the brother of Robert above .


Ciderdrinker

[Forfarian]

Marriages John Gibson and Elizabeth Miller 1 Sep 1832 Bervie /Arbuthnott or 8 April 1831 Edrom

As the 1832 marriage was recorded in both Arbuthnott and Bervie I am willing to bet that this is an entirely different couple who just happen to have the same names as the couple married in Edrom the previous year.

This Kincardineshire couple had seven children between 1833 and 1849, all baptised in Bervie. They are in Bervie in the 1841 and 1851 censuses, John shown in 1851 as born in Arbuthnott and Elizabeth in Bervie. There is nothing to suggest that they ever ventured as far as Berwickshire/Northumberland.

Elizabeth is in the 1861, 1871 and 1881 censuses in Bervie, recorded as married in 1861 and 1871 and widowed in 1881. Her husband John G was a builder, and it wasn't unusual for masons/builders to work away from home, but it makes it more difficult to find their death certificates.

Elizabeth Miller or Gibson, mother's maiden surname Wyllie, died in Bervie in 1886 aged 75. She is almost certainly the daughter of George Falkner Miller and Elisabeth Wyllie, baptised in Bervie in 1811, because John G and Elizabeth Miller's first daughter was named Elizabeth Wyllie, Miller.

There is a baptism of John Gibson, son of George, in Arbuthnott in 1808; and this couple's eldest son was named George. There is a marriage of George Gibson to Jannet Gibson in Arbuthnott in 1802, and John G and Elizabeth Miller named their second daughter Janet.

So as far as the subjects of this thread are concerned, the couple married in Bervie/Arbuthnott in 1832 are a red herring.