Author Topic: Thomas Offley Traynor b 1872  (Read 251 times)

Offline Leigh1

  • RootsChat Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 199
    • View Profile
Thomas Offley Traynor b 1872
« on: Sunday 14 May 23 10:49 BST (UK) »
Can anyone please help with the birth record for Thomas Offley Traynor? I believe he was born in Boston, Massachusetts in Sept 1872 to parents William Lawrence Traynor & Elizabeth Offley Traynor, natives of Manchester, England.  I believe a sibling - Lizzie Traynor - was also born in the States in 1874.  By 1876 the family had returned to England.  At that time, would being born in the USA confer automatic citizenship?
Thanks for your help.
Crumbie (Crumby/Crombie/Cromie) - Wilts, London, Northumberland, Fife
Stark & Cammann - Middxnt
Davenport, Bromley - Wilts, Glous
Traynor - Ireland, Hull, Kent
Taylor - Kent
Blaskiewicz / Blaszkiewicz - Radom, Poland
Drews - Gdansk (Danzig), Poland

Offline *Sandra*

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 58,736
  • Marie Curie
    • View Profile
Re: Thomas Offley Traynor b 1872
« Reply #1 on: Sunday 14 May 23 11:29 BST (UK) »
"We search for information, but the burden of proof is always with the thread owner"

Census information is Crown Copyright  http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

British Census copyright The National Archives; Canadian Census copyright Library and Archives Canada

Offline oldohiohome

  • RootsChat Aristocrat
  • ******
  • Posts: 2,807
    • View Profile
Re: Thomas Offley Traynor b 1872
« Reply #2 on: Sunday 14 May 23 13:50 BST (UK) »
Lizzie's birth in Lynn, MA, 1873
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:FX4C-S9C

Thomas' section of the tree at familysearch mentions a sister Nellie, born in 1875 in England
https://www.familysearch.org/tree/person/details/KFLX-7V2

Nellie
Birth 30 Aug 1875
18 Adams Place, Southwark, Surrey, England
Death 23 May 1961
Kenley, Surrey, England

That puts the family back in England by August 1875, if correct.

If you click on her on the tree, one of the sources is the 1939 Register of England which, I think, gives the exact dates of birth.

------------
Regarding citizenship, my guess was that being born in the US would have made the child a citizen. It does now, and it hasn't changed in at least the last 40 years, if ever.  And they are tightening the rules lately, not loosening them, so I'd guess it has always been that way. It might even be in the Constitution.
At any rate, Thomas' passport application says he was a natural born citizen of the US, and the form says "for native citizen." Although he does say his father is a native US citizen as well. Probably not, right? But they were probably more interested in Thomas' citizenship than his father's, if they checked it out.

Offline *Sandra*

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 58,736
  • Marie Curie
    • View Profile
Re: Thomas Offley Traynor b 1872
« Reply #3 on: Sunday 14 May 23 14:23 BST (UK) »
Thomas Offley Traynor


The Sydney Morning Herald
Sydney, New South Wales, New South Wales, Australia •
Fri, 6 Sept 1929
Page 9

https://www.newspapers.com/article/the-sydney-morning-herald/124643385/

Sandra
"We search for information, but the burden of proof is always with the thread owner"

Census information is Crown Copyright  http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

British Census copyright The National Archives; Canadian Census copyright Library and Archives Canada


Offline Leigh1

  • RootsChat Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 199
    • View Profile
Re: Thomas Offley Traynor b 1872
« Reply #4 on: Sunday 14 May 23 14:27 BST (UK) »
Thank you both so much - this is very helpful.  I don’t believe Thomas’ father, William, would have become a US citizen as he was not in the USA very long.  I’m assuming he came over for work & it didn’t pan out for him, so he went back home.  I have found records of Thomas visiting the States with his own children, at least one of which married whilst there.  Thank you again, much appreciated!
Crumbie (Crumby/Crombie/Cromie) - Wilts, London, Northumberland, Fife
Stark & Cammann - Middxnt
Davenport, Bromley - Wilts, Glous
Traynor - Ireland, Hull, Kent
Taylor - Kent
Blaskiewicz / Blaszkiewicz - Radom, Poland
Drews - Gdansk (Danzig), Poland

Offline *Sandra*

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 58,736
  • Marie Curie
    • View Profile
Re: Thomas Offley Traynor b 1872
« Reply #5 on: Sunday 14 May 23 14:28 BST (UK) »
The North Wales Weekly News
Colwyn Bay, Clwyd, Wales
Thu, 1 Jul 1920 Page 7

https://www.newspapers.com/article/the-north-wales-weekly-news/124643719/

Sandra
"We search for information, but the burden of proof is always with the thread owner"

Census information is Crown Copyright  http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

British Census copyright The National Archives; Canadian Census copyright Library and Archives Canada

Offline *Sandra*

  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • *******
  • Posts: 58,736
  • Marie Curie
    • View Profile
Re: Thomas Offley Traynor b 1872
« Reply #6 on: Sunday 14 May 23 14:33 BST (UK) »
1 October 1937 - Nice, Alpes-Maritimes, France

Re the death in France 1937 - see if there is anything here to help .....

https://www.thoughtco.com/how-to-research-french-ancestry-1421947

Sandra
"We search for information, but the burden of proof is always with the thread owner"

Census information is Crown Copyright  http://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

British Census copyright The National Archives; Canadian Census copyright Library and Archives Canada

Offline Leigh1

  • RootsChat Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 199
    • View Profile
Re: Thomas Offley Traynor b 1872
« Reply #7 on: Sunday 14 May 23 15:09 BST (UK) »
Thank you Sandra.  His career is well documented, his private life is complicated to say the least! 😂
Crumbie (Crumby/Crombie/Cromie) - Wilts, London, Northumberland, Fife
Stark & Cammann - Middxnt
Davenport, Bromley - Wilts, Glous
Traynor - Ireland, Hull, Kent
Taylor - Kent
Blaskiewicz / Blaszkiewicz - Radom, Poland
Drews - Gdansk (Danzig), Poland

Online shellyesq

  • Moderator
  • RootsChat Marquessate
  • ********
  • Posts: 13,633
    • View Profile
Re: Thomas Offley Traynor b 1872
« Reply #8 on: Sunday 14 May 23 15:49 BST (UK) »
As of the adoption of the 14th Amendment to the Constitution in 1868, people born in the US would be citizens.