Can anyone please help me extend my Irish tree?

[GuyMassey]

Jeremiah - the entry on the left page immediately below ‘September 1849

https://registers.nli.ie/registers/vtls000634870#page/208/mode/1up

Contraction of the name To Jerh. (Small h).
Parents Tom Sullivan and Nancy Hennigan with sponsors Danl Menihan and Nancy Barry.

The townland is possible ‘Cluainees’ which may be https://www.townlands.ie/cork/west-carbery-west-division/durrus/durrus-east/cloonee/

I don’t know how you would prove it either but you have births with the same named parents and the family names in censuses.

You have James aged 13 yrs in April 1871 and 23 yrs in 1881
Where do you have this record -
James's actual birth year is two years later,

Thank you!

The dating information that I have is as follows:

1871 Census - James is 13 = DOB = 1858
1881 Census - James is 23 = DOB = 1858
1901 Census - James is 42 = DOB = 1859
1887 Marriage Certificate dated  2nd July - James is 28 = DOB 1859 (Although the copy obtained by Mary when he died states 1st July)
1904 Death Certificate dated 25th January - James is 45 = DOB 1859

Unfortunately I do not have another birth record for him, but in view of the above, I feel that 1857 may be a little too early, although it is certainly the best lead to date. The following might explain the discrepancy.

It may be that he was mistaken when answering questions for the Census and got his own age wrong (I've done that!). This could then have been carried over when Mary registered the death, because the short marriage certificate she got when he died doesn't have his age on it.

Guy

[GuyMassey]

Oh, and the 1891 Census makes his DOB 1859 as well!

[Wexflyer]

Thank you!

The dating information that I have is as follows:

1871 Census - James is 13 = DOB = 1858
1881 Census - James is 23 = DOB = 1858
1901 Census - James is 42 = DOB = 1859
1887 Marriage Certificate dated  2nd July - James is 28 = DOB 1859 (Although the copy obtained by Mary when he died states 1st July)
1904 Death Certificate dated 25th January - James is 45 = DOB 1859

Unfortunately I do not have another birth record for him, but in view of the above, I feel that 1857 may be a little too early, although it is certainly the best lead to date. The following might explain the discrepancy.

It may be that he was mistaken when answering questions for the Census and got his own age wrong (I've done that!). This could then have been carried over when Mary registered the death, because the short marriage certificate she got when he died doesn't have his age on it.

Guy

I strongly disagree. The earliest - and therefore most likely to be accurate - census ages are entirely consistent with, indeed agree exactly with, the age of your putative James, born in October 1857.

That James would indeed be aged 13 at the time of the 1861 census, and 23 for the 1871.

I would also note that someone marked as 42 on the 1901 census is more likely to have been born in 1858 than 1859 [assuming the age to be correct, of course].

[GuyMassey]

I'm not disagreeing with you, I even suggested that he may have been mistaken about his age. I haven't checked what time of the year the Census was taken. Can you enlighten me please? It appears that his Death Certificate could well have his age wrong.
Guy

[Wexflyer]

I believe census dates were typically in April - exact date varied.

[heywood]

1871 - 2nd April
1881 - 3rd April
1891 - 5th April
1901- 31st March

With an October birthday, the ages shown on the census will be from the previous year. He was 13 yrs in October 1870, for example.

Ages in census often vary for all sorts of reasons.
Does Mary’s age vary in the censuses?

[GuyMassey]

Hello Heywood,

"Ages in census often vary for all sorts of reasons. Does Mary’s age vary in the censuses?"

Ha ha! Yes, you have proved your point!!!

1891 Mary is 27
1901 Mary is 36
1911 Mary is 43
1921 Mary is 54

In 1911 Mary has lost three years!

Looking closely at James's baptism in 1857 the end of the line appears to say "James & Mary Sullivan". Would these have been Thomas's parents as witnesses?

Thank you again for your input, I have been baffled by my Irish connection for so long. It is brilliant to see another perspective by someone with so much experience.

Guy

[Wexflyer]

Looking closely at James's baptism in 1857 the end of the line appears to say "James & Mary Sullivan". Would these have been Thomas's parents as witnesses?

Guy

Typically, no.

First, these are not witnesses. They are the godparents, or sponsors.
Usually brothers, sisters, cousins, or close neighbours/friends - but not grandparents.

[shanreagh]

Looking closely at James's baptism in 1857 the end of the line appears to say "James & Mary Sullivan". Would these have been Thomas's parents as witnesses?

Guy

Typically, no.

First, these are not witnesses. They are the godparents, or sponsors.
Usually brothers, sisters, cousins, or close neighbours/friends - but not grandparents.

Yes just to add to Wexflyer's point..you can see the letters 'SPs' or 'SSs' (don't know if it is a long S or a P)  - sponsors just before the names James & Mary Sullivan. 

NB to note the spelling of Henigan. It is important to note the spelling as it appears in the record rather than as it may have appeared in later records or as it is known by the family currently.