Tracing Kerr ancestors back to Scotland from Nova Scotia

[McJenn]

Happy to find this group. I’ve been researching my Kerr ancestors but I’m somewhat stuck on making the leap from Nova Scotia back to Scotland. I will include below a few details on the ancestors I'm currently researching, and if you have any thoughts on how to continue my research, I'd be very grateful!

Castle Kerr (~1792-1859) has been the centerpoint of my research. His son's bio says Castle arrived in Canada from Argyllshire with both his parents when he was about ten years old. Last year I found Castle's father's will in Nova Scotia (Alexander Kerr d. 1845) which named Castle and his siblings - Margaret, Catherine and John. It later mentioned Alexander’s two youngest children, Alexander and Hannah, by a woman named Hannah - I think this is a second wife. I would very much like to find the name of his first wife, Castle's mother, and continue my search for records in Scotland for their marriage and parents.

Much of the data I've collected on this family is stored in FamilySearch. The link is https://www.familysearch.org/tree/person/details/LTSH-C3Q.

I've explored Scotlands People for records with fathers and children with these names and while I've found several possible families, none include Castle, Cassell, Cathel, or similar.

Any suggestion on how to proceed? Thanks!

[goldie61]

Hi McJenn and welcome to Rootschat.
I see 30 people have looked at your post, but as yet no reply to it.
You will discover that  most queries posted here on Rootscaht are replied to pretty swiftly, and there are some some very experienced, knowledgeable researchers on here, including Scottish experts.
That makes me think it has been very difficult for anybody to find anything to help you.
I see from your familysearch site you have found a great deal of interesting information and evidence about the family after their arrival in Canada.
A couple of questions:
1. Do you have any other evidence that the Kerr family came from Argyll?
You quote a  ‘bio’ of Castle’s son as where you got this information.
This would have been written quite some time after their arrival in Canada.
I have found, as many others have, that family ‘facts’ can turn out to be a little different. Stories may be mis-remembered, or only partly remembered, or embroidered over time.
2. Was Castle the only child to have been born in Scotland? You have siblings as Margaret, Catherine and John. I think I saw the baptism of Catherine in 1804 in Canada on your site. what about Margaret and John?
If Castle was about 10 years old when they arrived in Canada, it’s likely they had other children in Scotland before going to Canada.
3. Have you found their arrival in Canada? I didn’t see any documentation to that fact on your site. What date do you think that was? It’s possible they didn’t go directly to Nova Scotia.

‘Castle’ is such an unusual name, one would think it was a family name passed down.

Have you seen, (and probably discounted!), the many hits that come up on familysearch for ‘Cathel Kerr’ in Assynt, Sutherland?
For example, Cathel Kerr baptised 10.12.1802, father Alexander Kerr, mother Christian McLellan.
This is a baptism of course, and it may be the child was born some time before this. The register may give more information.
Familysearch have the film for Assynt, number 7907468. It is digitised, but locked, so you have to visit a familysearch library to view it.  It is just baptisms and marriages. No deaths at all. There is a search icon next to the locked film icon however, and you can search for all the Kerr families there. The name Cathel Kerr comes up several times, as sons of various Kerr male fathers. It was obviously a family name that was passed down.
The Assynt register only starts in 1798 according to the film information. It may have been a new church set up then. What they did before that I haven’t looked into, but I can’t see any earlier records either on familysearch or Scotlands people.
I know it’s a long way from Argyll, but it may be worth looking into in the absence of anything else.

Good luck!

[wivenhoe]

" It later mentioned Alexander’s two youngest children, Alexander and Hannah, by a woman named Hannah"

Can you please transcribe what you are seeing.

When was the Will written?  Who are they witnesses?

What did the estate consist of?.

Are children treated equally as beneficiaries.
 

[McJenn]

Thanks for the warm welcome goldie61 - I very much appreciate your helpful response!!

1. Do you have any other evidence that the Kerr family came from Argyll?
Castle's son's bio was written while he was still alive (sometime after 1910) and states Argylshire. The same son's 1926 death certificate in Iowa also says Argylshire for place of father's birth. That's it. Neither of these are terribly definitive so I have been open to other areas in my search in case the story had been embroidered over time (I like that phrase

2. Was Castle the only child to have been born in Scotland?
Unknown. My link to the baptism of Catherine in 1804 in Canada is speculative but I added for now as the names and dates could make that Catherine part of this family. I've always thought it likely that at least some of those other children were born in Scotland.

What about Margaret and John?
No idea - hoping to find their records as well.

3. Have you found their arrival in Canada?
I haven't found ship records with their names though I have looked a bit. I've seen a William Kerr and an Alexander Kerr listed as early settlers in Digby NS. Alexander arrived in 1789 on the Mary Ann according to a book on the farming history of the area.
Castle's grave suggests he was born in 1792, but another bit of family lore says he was 16 when the war of 1812 occurred so that would be 1796. I've been assuming he arrived around the turn of the century. My husbands McMillin family landed in Ireland before coming to the US so that's possible, but the journey direct to Nova Scotia seems common from what I've read.

Have you seen, (and probably discounted!), the many hits that come up on familysearch for ‘Cathel Kerr’ in Assynt, Sutherland? For example, Cathel Kerr baptised 10.12.1802, father Alexander Kerr, mother Christian McLellan. This is a baptism of course, and it may be the child was born some time before this.
This is a great clue and I don't recall seeing this before. I think its because it's indexed as ALEXR. KERR and doesn't come up when searching father Alex on Scotland's people, even with phonetic matching.
Would you say baptisms could sometimes happen years after the fact? Castle was married in 1815 so this family only works if they finally decided to baptize him before they got on the boat!

Familysearch have the film for Assynt, number 7907468.
Conveniently my local library has just announced that have become a FamilySearch Affiliate!
But I was impatient and got the file from Scotlands people. No additional info, but can't decipher the last place name. Trying to attach but too large.

Thanks for reading!

[McJenn]

Hi wivenhoe,

Thanks for your questions. Alexander Kerr’s will says the following:

First I order all my just and lawful debts and personal expenses to be paid. I give and bequeath to each of my children to Will, my Daughter Margret, my Daughter Catherine, my Son Castle and my Son John ten shilling good and lawful money of the Province of Nova Scotia aforesaid to be paid out of my movable Estate. I also give and bequeath to my dearly beloved Wife Hannah all my Landed property together with what may be left after paying the above bequeaths during her natural life or as long as she remains my widow that is to say as soon as she enters into matrimony connection after my decease or departs this life my landed and other property remaining then at that time to be divided to my two youngest children by the said Hannah, Alexander and Hannah. Alexander to have all my landed property and moveable estate on paying my youngest daughter Hannah twelve pounds lawful money of Nova Scotia. I do have by constitute make and ordain my dearly beloved wife Hannah my executor together with Capt William Taylor and Capt Thomas Smally Digby my executors of this my last will and Testament.

*******

I read this to say Alexander had Margaret, Catherine, Castle and John with a first wife in Scotland and possibly in Digby. Then he marries Hannah in Nova Scotia and has Alexander and Hannah.



Will was written April 13, 1832. Died October 4, 1845.

Names noted at the end of the will are Archibald McNeill(?) and Samuel Sanders.

What did the estate consist of?
Mostly outlined in what I transcribed. There is a list for the estate but can't read the faded writing.

Are children treated equally as beneficiaries.
No


Thanks your help!

[Forfarian]

Maybe a silly question, but have you checked using variant spellings, for example Ker, Carr, Keir and so on?

[goldie61]

Have you seen, (and probably discounted!), the many hits that come up on familysearch for ‘Cathel Kerr’ in Assynt, Sutherland? For example, Cathel Kerr baptised 10.12.1802, father Alexander Kerr, mother Christian McLellan. This is a baptism of course, and it may be the child was born some time before this.
This is a great clue and I don't recall seeing this before. I think its because it's indexed as ALEXR. KERR and doesn't come up when searching father Alex on Scotland's people, even with phonetic matching.
Would you say baptisms could sometimes happen years after the fact?

I find familysearch is much better at finding variations of names than Scotlandspeople. (Sometimes more than you'd like!).

In fact the baptism of one of the younger children, Alexander, is written as Alexander Ker.
He was baptised 28th May 1824 at Digby, father Alexander, mother Hannah. No wife's surname. Interestingly it says 'Scotland' and 'Digby' in the entry. I wonder why. It also states he was a yeoman.
These Digby registers on familysearch seem to be books of typed transcriptions. Do you know if there are actual hand written registers McJenn?
I had a look through several pages, but couldn't see a baptism for the daughter Hannah, or the burial of a previous wife of Alexander senior.

Yes, sometimes children can be quite old by the time they were baptised. I have one family in Scotland who baptised 5 children on the same day. I think because there had been a new church of their denomination built near to them, whereas before they would have had to go a long way to get to a church.
It's not uncommon to see two or three children baptised together - there could be a variety of reasons for this. Perhaps their parents were too busy to find the time, or unable to find the fee, or were sick, or away from home, or as above, or the church was just too far away to get to. Many reasons.


Can you crop and post the entry for Cathell in Assynt?
It would be interesting to see what it says, and we might be able to work out the missing word.

[Forfarian]

McJenn sent me the page from the OPR. See attached.

ED is short for Eodem Die, which is Latin for 'On the same day'. The date on the first baptism that day is 10 December.

I read it as Cathel lawl Son of Alexr Kerr and Christian McLellan his spouse tenant in Store.

Lawl is the abbreviation of lawful and it means legitimate, i.e. the parents were married (unlike the parents of Ann, four lines down the page, who was 'natural' as opposed to 'lawful').

Store will be the place now mapped as Stoer. See https://www.geograph.org.uk/gridref/NC0328 and https://maps.nls.uk/geo/explore/#zoom=14.7&lat=58.20082&lon=-5.32573&layers=5&b=1

[Forfarian]

Cathel Kerr seems to have been quite a common name in that area.

There are just 18 baptisms of Cathels in the whole of Scotland in the OPRs, all but two in Assynt. Of these sixteen baptisms of Cathels in Assynt before 1855, ten are Cathel Kerr and four more are the sons of women whose surname was Kerr.

There are 14 deaths of Cathel Kerr in Sutherland the statutory deaths index between 1855 and the present day, of whom six died in Stoer (not including the son of Christian McLellan, who did not die in Scotland after 1855).

There are 113 male Cathels in the Scottish censuses 1841-1901, 78 of whom are in Sutherland. 17 are listed in Assynt, and 51 in Stoer after it was split off as a registration district. 38 of the Sutherland ones have the surname Kerr.

So it appears that there must have been some particular fondness for the name Cathel among Kerrs in Stoer in the parish of Assynt.

Castle, on the other hand, is an exceptionally rare first given name. The Quick Search on SP finds 5,704 records of people with Castle as one of their given names. However only six of them actually record Castle as a first given name, and three of these (one birth, one marriage and one death) are the same individual. All the rest have Castle or Castles as a middle name.