Polish ancestor that is Jewish

[crissi]

Hi Dirk,

I am descended from Carolus Josephus (*1792). His grandson Anton had taken over the Heidhof (Vormeppen) and died there early at the age of 56. My grandmother was the youngest of his 12 children at the time and moved away from Meppen with her mother to live with an older daughter who was married in Bremen. After the Second World War, I believe there were three Augustin sisters living there, but all married, so the name Augustin no longer appears in this branch. But we all have a replica of David Hirsch's portrait somewhere in the drawer :-)

The Ohio Augustin was probably Anton's little brother Bernhard, who died in the great earthquake in San Francisco? I have seen a bad copy of a postcard to Nikolaus junior, the mayor's son.

Well, if only the connection to the silk manufacturer could be proven. https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jacob_Jacobson and his team have documented his origins extremely well. There is a trace to Lissa, but when people perish in a fire, there are no gravestones afterwards. And although there are public orphan registers, I have not yet been able to decipher a corresponding entry (if any Jewish children were included who were staying with their godfather in Potsdam). And while the velvet manufacturer submitted applications to Friedrich Wilhelm for his older sons in order to obtain a protection privilege for them too, there is no such entry for the orphan. It was very expensive at the time and was only possible for a few relatives - everyone else had to leave the city. Why not in the direction of Meppen ...

Regards, Christoph

[BartJSimpson]

Hi Christoph,
the name of the "Ohio Augustin" was indeed Bernhard but he died in Portsmouth (Ohio) in 1917 with 86 years. And his son, also named Bernhard, died in 1930 in Portsmouth.

Until now I was not aware that also some descendants of Carolus Josephus junior (*1792) were living in Bremen. I'm interested in more details because I still try to "collect" as much info of the descendants of Carolus Josephus Augustin senior as possible. Carolus Josephus junior had 14 children and at least 70 grandchildren, several with name Anton. 

Hopefully one time we can find out more about the live and the ancestors of Carolus Josephus senior. Would be very interesting.

Regards,
Dirk

[crissi]

You have PM

[J. Augustin]

Great to find this website and to see that I'm not the only one trying to find out more about Jacobus David Samuel Hirsch. I am a direct 5th generation descendant from his second marriage (1804) to Phennena Catharina Schleper (* July 2nd, 1772 + August 20th, 1838) and still carry the family name since his conversion in 1787. The origin of his new surname lies in the baptism date itself: Since Jacobus David Samuel Hirsch was baptised as a Catholic in Meppen on August 28, 1787, he took the name of the day's Saint, i.e. St. Augustine of Hippo. His godfather was the local judge Carl Franz Morrien. He might have taken his new first name from him.

I live near Düsseldorf in Germany, not far from the Emsland, whose today's administrative centre is Meppen. After a few years, Carolus Josephus Augustin (aka Jacobus David Samuel Hirsch) bought a house in the immediate vicinity of the historic town hall and set up a shop there.

The photo in the first entry (Bolts99) is taken from the book "Land und Leute im Wandel der Zeit an Ems und Hase" by Hermann Friese. There is more information about his origins in the book, but not too much about his parents, yet apparently his father was involved in the skins, furs and horse trade in Lissa.

CJ Augustin himself is said to have been given the nickname “Augustin Hollandtü” in Meppen, this is because he also sold goods in Holland.

In Emsland there are two streets named after descendants of Carolus Josephus Augustin today: Nicolaus-Augustin-Straße in Meppen and Dr.-Augustin-Straße in Dörpen.

I also found a newspaper article about the origins of the Augustin family from 1989.

[crissi]

Best regards to Düsseldorf. “Phenenna” and “Euphmina” are probably the same name - I have the baptism and marriage with “CJ" aka David Hirsch here. Her mother I read “Drexler". If anyone has more on this strand of the family, I'd be happy to have leads, as they played a big role in the Augustin household. David Hirsch's eldest son (also a Carl Joseph) was married first to Anna Margareta and then Sophia Gertrudis Drexler (apparently they are not sisters). And if they were also related to the father's second wife, one would like to know more about it, it does arouse curiosity

Birth https://data.matricula-online.eu/de/deutschland/osnabrueck/meppen-st-vitus/0185/?pg=8
Marriage https://data.matricula-online.eu/de/deutschland/osnabrueck/meppen-st-vitus/0057/?pg=13

[bolts99]

Hi Christoph,
thank you for these interesting infos.

I've found a 312 page pdf file in the internet which has a lot of info about the silk manufacturer David Hirsch:

https://medien.bwv-verlag.de/Open_Access/9783830542483.pdf

He lived from 1700 to 1773.

But unfortunatelly I couldn't find any remark that he adopted a nephew.

Would really be nice to find any evidences of the time before our ancestor came to Meppen and some more details about his parents and so on.

As I wrote before I did a lot of research of his direct descendants and I found out that nearly all of his descendant (if not all) which are living today will be descendants of him with his first wife. They together had four children:

1) Johanna Maria Elisabeth Augustin, *22.10.1789, married Ludwig Wahden. One of their children emigrated already 1837 to Cole County, Missouri, USA and renamed to "Watton". 

2) Carolus Josephus Augustin, *23.5.1792. One of his children emigrated 1870 to Portsmouth, Ohio, USA. I'm in direct contact with descendants of him which are still living in Ohio.

3) Johannes Bernardus Augustin, *22.6.1795, was major of Haselünne.

4) Johanus Henricus Antonius Augustin, *13.4.1799. One of his childs (my ancestor Nicolaus Augustin) was mayor of Meppen from 1871 till 1897.

Who of them is your direct ancestor ?

Regards,
Dirk

Dirk my direct ancestor is the Wahden one. Herman Watton was the one that immigrated to the United States with his in laws, wife's family.

[bolts99]

Great to find this website and to see that I'm not the only one trying to find out more about Jacobus David Samuel Hirsch. I am a direct 5th generation descendant from his second marriage (1804) to Phennena Catharina Schleper (* July 2nd, 1772 + August 20th, 1838) and still carry the family name since his conversion in 1787. The origin of his new surname lies in the baptism date itself: Since Jacobus David Samuel Hirsch was baptised as a Catholic in Meppen on August 28, 1787, he took the name of the day's Saint, i.e. St. Augustine of Hippo. His godfather was the local judge Carl Franz Morrien. He might have taken his new first name from him.

I live near Düsseldorf in Germany, not far from the Emsland, whose today's administrative centre is Meppen. After a few years, Carolus Josephus Augustin (aka Jacobus David Samuel Hirsch) bought a house in the immediate vicinity of the historic town hall and set up a shop there.

The photo in the first entry (Bolts99) is taken from the book "Land und Leute im Wandel der Zeit an Ems und Hase" by Hermann Friese. There is more information about his origins in the book, but not too much about his parents, yet apparently his father was involved in the skins, furs and horse trade in Lissa.

CJ Augustin himself is said to have been given the nickname “Augustin Hollandtü” in Meppen, this is because he also sold goods in Holland.

In Emsland there are two streets named after descendants of Carolus Josephus Augustin today: Nicolaus-Augustin-Straße in Meppen and Dr.-Augustin-Straße in Dörpen.

I also found a newspaper article about the origins of the Augustin family from 1989.

Do you have that article from 1989?  I would like to see it.   I am from the first marriage of David Samual Hirsch. My Wahden line moved to the United States in 1837.

Thank's for the book name. I had a german genealogy researcher find that for me but this is one of my few brick walls left to find.