St Pancras Old Church Baptism of Alfred Audley 21st November 1819

[WirralLad]

Hi jonw65

Thanks for that suggestion I will follow your suggestion up

Looking again at the baptism record for Alfred Audley on 21st November 1819 at St Pancreas could the mother's name be Jane and not Sarah as suggested by Family search or Ann as suggested by Ancestry? Although I cannot make the father's name read William.

Can you make out the street name, where they lived or the fathers occupation?

Do you think there could be two people called Alfred Audley

Regards
Wirral Lad

[Bookbox]

Looking at Alfred Audley’s baptism in St Pancras in 1819, I agree the mother is Jane, despite Ancestry’s transcription(s). The father isn’t William or Wade. His name might start with M, or it might be Inman (see below). I think the address in this baptism entry is Seymour Street, and he is a Green Grocer.

There is also at St Pancras a baptism of a daughter to parents named Audley with a mother Jane, on 7 November 1821 (born 10 October). I think the address there is Johnson Street (which is off Seymour Street), and the father is a Beadle. The father’s name has been transcribed (by Ancestry) as Inman, which is a possibility, though my first thought was that his name might begin with G. Again, it certainly isn’t William or Wade. I can’t read the daughter’s forename either, though it begins with D.

Yes, there could be two Alfred Audley, both born in St Pancras. It certainly isn’t straightforward.

[Bookbox]

The 1841 marriage of Alfred shows his father Wade Audley was a Wine Merchant.

A Wade Audley, Victualler of Grafton Street East, was bankrupted in 1830 (London Gazette). Robson's 1830 London directory shows his address as London University Hotel, 29 Grafton Street East.

A Wade Audley, aged 48, died in 1830 and was buried on 6 September at St Mark Kennington, from Dorset Place (indexed by Ancestry as Andley).

[jonw65]

Looking again at the baptism record for Alfred Audley on 21st November 1819 at St Pancreas could the mother's name be Jane and not Sarah as suggested by Family search or Ann as suggested by Ancestry?

Hi
I did suggest that the mother's name on the baptism record might be Jane in Reply #1
And Wade as father's name on Alfred's marriage record, also in Reply #1

Father's occupation on the baptism, my first thought was Green Grocer (but I was not at all sure), so I am glad that Bookbox has suggested that

[jonw65]

I do think it is absolutely scandalous that ancestry have had these London records for nearly two decades, and, more often than not, they have not been able or willing to provide better images than are obtainable from some of the poor microfilm copies.

A lot of the St Saviour Southwark baptism register in the 1760's and 1770s is completely unreadable, images from the (non LDS) microfilm
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageviewer/collections/1624/images/31280_195132-00372

Why do the LMA think it is acceptable?

[WirralLad]

Bookbox and jon65

Apologies for not replying sooner.

Bookbox
Thanks for the additional information about Wade Audley
When I looked at the baptism record for Alfred Audley I  formed the opinion that the first letter of his father might be M  and that is why I asked the question could there be 2 people called Alfred Audley living at the same time.
With regard to the Audley baptism of 7th November 1821. I came across on ancestry a typed list of those people baptised at St Pancras Church in 1821. and that list gives a  Dorinda Audley as being baptised on 7th  November 1821. Unfortunately the list just gives name and date.

jon65
I know you  suggested that Alfred's mother may be called Jane in Reply #1 I assumed by mistake that your statement was based on the fact that a  Jane Ann Audley was a witness to the marriage, rather than and interpretation of the baptism record of 21st November 1819.

We know  from Christine53 that a William Wade Audley married a Jane Turtil in 1807; so is William Wade Audley the same  person as Wade Audley or a different person?

Also if a Jane married a William Wade Audley in 1807 and the mothers name on Alfred's baptism in 1819 is Jane but the is not William suggests that there may be two wives called Jane Audley!!

With your comments about the  quality of the London images I guess that the LMA does not have the funding to have the records scanned a second time and well Ancestry has our money and re-scanning the images would reduce their profit and I suppose they would prefer to spend money on scanning new documents rather than improving old documents.

Regards
Wirral Lad

[jonw65]

Hi
There are a couple of other baptisms in London to William and Jane, William Turtill Audley, 4 Nov 1814, and Emma Audley, 25 Feb 1816.
Emma was mentioned in an old, brief thread here on Rootschat, I think they decided it was the wrong Emma?
Audley does not seem to be a very common name, certainly not in London. But I guess there could be two couples, and a second Jane with a husband whose name we can't pin down. There is no further sign so far of Dorinda.
Jon

[WirralLad]

Hi All,
I now have what I believe is the definitive answer to my original question.
At the time of posting my original message I sent an e-mail to the London Metropolitan Archives posing the same question to them. The answer I received this afternoon is as follows:

Thank you for your recent enquiry
Unfortunately the original parish register is also extremely faded and it is very difficult to work out the names of the individuals though I had a feeling the wife was potentially Jane.
I therefore looked at the Bishops Transcripts which is a copy of the entry that would have been made in the same year (when it would have been much more legible) and which was sent to the Bishop ref: DL/T/066/019, fortunately this entry was not as faded.
From this I can see that the fathers name was William and the mothers name was indeed Jane.
I have attached an image of the entry. I hope this helps.

I have looked at the image that I was e-mailed and the Bishop's transcript clearly  shows the parents as William and Jane address Seymour Street occupation Green Grocer.
So I can only conclude that Alfred's father was William Wade Audley and  he married as such to Jane Turtil in 1807. When he was baptising his children he was recorded as William. He became known as Wade his second forename by the time he was declared bankrupt and died in 1830, and then by the time Alfred was married his father was recorded as Wade. That is my conclusion unless you can show that I am wrong.

Regards
Wirral Lad

[jonw65]

Hi
Excellent news.
Well done for contacting the LMA, and what a brilliant response from them.
Jon