Author Topic: Kearns family  (Read 865 times)

Offline gaffy

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Re: Kearns family
« Reply #18 on: Friday 29 September 23 20:01 BST (UK) »
Just to rattle off some births for the other O'Brien children shown in the 1901 and 1911 censuses, to corroborate the John O'Brien - Margaret Graham parentage:

- James b. 1875:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1875/03103/2137948.pdf (father John was a 'Porter')

- Josephine b. 1877:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1877/02999/2099244.pdf (father John was a 'Wine Porter')

- Patrick b. 1880:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1880/02874/2053189.pdf (father John was a 'Wine Porter')

- Kathleen b. 1883:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1883/02750/2010433.pdf (father John was a 'Cellar Clerk')


Offline gaffy

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Re: Kearns family
« Reply #19 on: Friday 29 September 23 20:59 BST (UK) »
It looks like the first O'Brien child was a son Patrick in 1859:
https://churchrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/display-pdf.jsp?pdfName=st.mary%27s-pro-cath_mf_1858-1865_ba_0210 (entry #2460)

There was a daughter Jane in 1866 (baptised Bridget Jane):
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1866/03543/2304196.pdf

There was a son John in 1870:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1870/03361/2232554.pdf

A son Thomas in 1873:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1873/03198/2172738.pdf

Baptismal records for some of the above are available under 'Church Records' on the 'irishgenealogy' website.

And also that widowed daughter 'Mary Vause' in the 1911 census return, here's her marriage in 1899 to William Vause:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1899/10371/5775869.pdf


Offline Abhanliath

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Re: Kearns family
« Reply #20 on: Saturday 30 September 23 06:30 BST (UK) »
Gaffy, the disappearing and reappearing O and Mac come from part of Ireland's grim history before independence. In the 16th/17th century, people with 'Mac' or 'O' in their surname – in other words, native Irish – were barred from Dublin unless they had a pass to work in the city. The various later laws aiming to wipe out Catholicism and native culture, and the customs attaching to them, also targeted the Macs and Os. By the late 18th century, a lot of Irish families in the Anglosphere had dropped the Mac and O part of their name, so O'Briens became Briens, MacCarthys became Carthys and so on.
A workaround appeared for Macs: a name like MacCarthy would be written as M'Carthy in a kind of nominative bowdlerism.
In the early 20th centuries there was a great reclamation of names, where people re-glued the Mac or O to their surname; some who still had the Mac but spelled in a way considered more Scottish, as Mc, changed the name back to Mac. Sometimes you'd have parents who were Mc and the next generation were Mac. Sometimes just one of a family used Mac and the rest Mac, or vice versa.
And as the Irish language became more important, some used this version of their name, so a Carthy would be come Mac Carthaigh, or in the case of a woman Ní Charthaigh, or for a married woman who had been called Mrs Jane Carthy, Sinéad Bean Mhic Charthaigh…
Using the Irish-language version of the name became more unusual during and after the Civil War of 1922-23, when cynicism about the language spread in that cruel regime…

Offline Abhanliath

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Re: Kearns family
« Reply #21 on: Sunday 01 October 23 18:18 BST (UK) »
Can anyone clear up for me when exactly the birth, marriage and death registrations start and stop on the Civil Records online site?
I've been having a look at the family of Thomas Keenan, born 1903; his parents married in 1884 and had 13 children by 1911, of whom 6 survived…
I've found three of these seven deaths (all in 14 New Bride Street, all of TB) – Esther and Stephen, who died between days of each other in 1902, one aged 8, the other 10; and Rosanna, who died aged 15 in 1906. Haven't found the other four.
Thomas himself married (to Mary McCarthy) in 1924 and they had one child. But I can find no records of births after 1924 for any Keenans. (Mary died in Rugby in England in 1962; I know their child was dead by 1968 but I don't know when; Thomas himself died on New Year's Day 1971, but I don't know where or of what – I think he must have died in England too, and I can't find that record.
I'm always winging it looking for the online Irish records because I don't know the exact dates when the records started (or when the online records start) and when they finish…


Online heywood

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Re: Kearns family
« Reply #22 on: Sunday 01 October 23 18:26 BST (UK) »
It’s on the Home page of the site
https://www.irishgenealogy.ie/en/

‘Update to the Civil Records’. If it doesn’t come up straight away, just move through -left or right.
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Online heywood

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Re: Kearns family
« Reply #23 on: Sunday 01 October 23 18:29 BST (UK) »
There is an index here https://www.familysearch.org/search/collection/1408347 to 1958, for the ones after 1922.
The later ones have a mother’s name, I think, but it is difficult if it is a popular surname or you don’t know first names.
Census Information is Crown Copyright, from www.nationalarchives.gov.uk

Offline Kiltaglassan

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Re: Kearns family
« Reply #24 on: Sunday 01 October 23 18:29 BST (UK) »

Adding to what heywood said-

Quote
Can anyone clear up for me when exactly the birth, marriage and death registrations start and stop on the Civil Records online site?

The published year is wrong (2023 instead of 2022) but this is the current update to the civil records.

https://www.irishgenealogy.ie/en/news/154-update-to-the-civil-records-3

"An additional year of historic Births, Marriages and Deaths (Index entry and register image) are now available to view on the website www.irishgenealogy.ie website. The records now available online include: Birth register records – 1864 to 1922; Marriage register records – 1845 to 1947 & Death register records – 1871* to 1972."


Researching: Cuthbertson – Co. Derry, Scotland & Australia; Hunter – Co. Derry; Jackson – Co. Derry, Scotland & Canada; Scott – Co. Derry; Neilly – Co. Antrim & USA; McCurdy – Co. Antrim; Nixon – Co. Cavan, Co. Donegal, Canada & USA; Ryan & Noble – Co. Sligo

Offline Abhanliath

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Re: Kearns family
« Reply #25 on: Sunday 01 October 23 18:32 BST (UK) »
Thank you so much! That's a real help to me!

Offline gaffy

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Re: Kearns family
« Reply #26 on: Sunday 01 October 23 18:34 BST (UK) »
And just to qualify that the civil marriage record coverage from 1845 is for non Catholic marriages, registration of Catholic marriages only started from 1864.