Apparent Error in GRO Copy, Can GRO Check Original?

[Jebber]

The Church have two registers, the couple sign both, one is kept by the Church the other goes to the Register Office.

The Register Office make a copy, theses are sent quarterly to the GRO. If you can obtain  a photocopy from either the  Church or the district Register Office you should see the original signatures.

I don't think so. Perhaps you are thinking of English CofE practice?
I have never seen any supposed church copy of a historic civil register in any church I have visited. I think the original register was only kept in the church until full (if ever), then transferred to the district registry office. Perhaps others can comment.

In any case, I know that the Irish district registry office copies were all transferred to the central GRO around 20 years ago, so the option  to consult those no longer exists. In the 1990s I previously consulted the district registry originals.

Yes,  I was referring to English records, I was confused because  the heading stated the GRO which deals with English and Welsh BMDs, not Irish records.

[Wexflyer]

The Church have two registers, the couple sign both, one is kept by the Church the other goes to the Register Office.

The Register Office make a copy, theses are sent quarterly to the GRO. If you can obtain  a photocopy from either the  Church or the district Register Office you should see the original signatures.

I don't think so. Perhaps you are thinking of English CofE practice?
I have never seen any supposed church copy of a historic civil register in any church I have visited. I think the original register was only kept in the church until full (if ever), then transferred to the district registry office. Perhaps others can comment.

In any case, I know that the Irish district registry office copies were all transferred to the central GRO around 20 years ago, so the option  to consult those no longer exists. In the 1990s I previously consulted the district registry originals.

Yes,  I was referring to English records, I was confused because  the heading stated the GRO which deals with English and Welsh BMDs, not Irish records.

England is not the only part of the world you know. There is a GRO in Ireland too.

[athacliath62]

The Church should have a register, sometimes with slightly more detailed information, e.g. mother's name - presumably one of the twin churches in the town. For births and deaths there would have been a local registrar's register which is sometimes available, but I dont believe this applies for marriages , as the forms went straight to the GRO.

[Wexflyer]

The Church should have a register, sometimes with slightly more detailed information, e.g. mother's name - presumably one of the twin churches in the town. For births and deaths there would have been a local registrar's register which is sometimes available, but I dont believe this applies for marriages , as the forms went straight to the GRO.

Afraid I have to disagree with these comments

The images of the Wexford parish registers online on the NLI website stop in February 1881, just a few months before the marriage in question in May 1881. You can see that the registers were still in what one might call a very basic format - just the names of the parties, the witnesses, and the date, nothing else, not even an address.

As for there not being a local district registration original (not copy) - there was! If you look at the certification at the bottom of the page on GRO link I provided (repeated here for ease of reference), you will see that it explicitly says that it is a copy of the original district register. Those historic original registers remained in the district registries until a policy change about 20 years ago, which saw them all transferred to the GRO at that point.
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1881/11004/8023666.pdf

[shanreagh]

As I said I have not had any experience in contacting the GRO, other than for actual certificates,  but there is the usual Co Roscommon address, which you will know...

I have put it in together with a little bit about the GRO in ireland to help those confused thinking it is the English/Welsh one. 

The history of irish records in themselves is just about as fascinating as the subjects of those records - says one who has inspected records still in local custody (the Vicarage in that case) and searched for the location of others where the local copies have been held away from the local churches, some Presbytarian ones in NI, not to mention the myths about how many were lost in 1922...some were but not all by any means. 

https://www.gov.ie/en/organisation-information/143f25-about-the-general-register-office/#

[Wexflyer]

As I said I have not had any experience in contacting the GRO, other than for actual certificates,  but there is the usual Co Roscommon address, which you will know...

I have put it in together with a little bit about the GRO in ireland to help those confused thinking it is the English/Welsh one. 

The history of irish records in themselves is just about as fascinating as the subjects of those records - says one who has inspected records still in local custody (the Vicarage in that case) and searched for the location of others where the local copies have been held away from the local churches, some Presbytarian ones in NI, not to mention the myths about how many were lost in 1922...some were but not all by any means. 

https://www.gov.ie/en/organisation-information/143f25-about-the-general-register-office/#

I guess I will have to try their general contact route.
I was hoping someone might have some experience with reporting historic errors, and whether they are responsive.

[Tickettyboo]

I had a query about a birth certificate years ago.
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=723271.msg5673401#msg5673401

Different scenario to yours but I never did get a response to the mail with both records attached.

Having checked out every other possible source of info about the person whose birth it was, I finally accepted that on balance the other sources confirmed that  the copy certificate that had sat in a drawer at my in-laws' house for as long as I'd known them had an error made at the time of issue.

Boo

[Wexflyer]

I had a query about a birth certificate years ago.
https://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=723271.msg5673401#msg5673401

Different scenario to yours but I never did get a response to the mail with both records attached.

Having checked out every other possible source of info about the person whose birth it was, I finally accepted that on balance the other sources confirmed that  the copy certificate that had sat in a drawer at my in-laws' house for as long as I'd known them had an error made at the time of issue.

Boo

Looking back at the your previous thread, they (the GRO) did communicate with you, and checked both original (local) and GRO copies.... and told you what they found.  I am not sure it was reasonable to expect any more. Of course the GRO copies are all online these days so, you can look yourself, and browse all entries online. As you were told, I only see an 1883 registration for your Sarah Connor
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1883/02748/2009836.pdf

What interests me, though, in what you said in the previous thread is that the original Urlingford registers were seemingly still held locally in 2015? That conflicts with what I was told in Wexford ~15-20 years ago - that all the local registers were  moved to the central GRO for "safety". Previously they were kept locally - I used to research them in person before the internet era.

[Tickettyboo]

Looking back at the your previous thread, they (the GRO) did communicate with you, and checked both original (local) and GRO copies.... and told you what they found.  I am not sure it was reasonable to expect any more. Of course the GRO copies are all online these days so, you can look yourself, and browse all entries online. As you were told, I only see an 1883 registration for your Sarah Connor
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1883/02748/2009836.pdf

What interests me, though, in what you said in the previous thread is that the original Urlingford registers were seemingly still held locally in 2015? That conflicts with what I was told in Wexford ~15-20 years ago - that all the local registers were  moved to the central GRO for "safety". Previously they were kept locally - I used to research them in person before the internet era.

my last post in that thread said:
My final step is to ask the GRO what, if anything, is in the copy register for 1889 for the date on the cert issued in 1917 and if they can check it with the local registrar. If there IS an entry in 1889 for this child, its not in the GRO index but if they can find one I will get the ref and purchase the scan. I suspect they won't find one though and at that stage I'll be done.


It was that mail they didn't respond to, I was trying to ascertain if an entry had been skipped when copying the original register to the one to be submitted to the GRO- long shot but I thought it was a possible scenario. At that time there was no online access and even if there was I still would only see entries that 'had' been copied over.

Perhaps they too thought that an 'unreasonable' request -  that is their choice, but I work on the basis that if I don't ask I have NO chance at all of finding out.

Good luck with your query when you send it
Boo