Another French marriage contract from Rodiere

[goldie61]

I’d be grateful for some help with a few queries in this marriage contract. I don’t need it fully transcribed or translated thanks.

It’s Péronne Sanlecque I’m interested in.

She is the daughter of Philippe, (given as ‘Ph’ here), and Michelle Fournel.
Does she have 2 brothers both called Pierre?

‘ass de P(ie)re Sanlecque, l’ainé; de P(ie)re le jeune, ses frères’.

I think I’m correct in saying ‘l’ainé’ is the eldest, and ‘le jeune’ is the young(er).

There also 2 ‘Jeanne Sanlecques’.
One married to Charles D’aire, They were married in 1637 - I have their contract,
Her father was Philippe.
The other Jeanne Sanlecque is married to Guillaume Hesdoul, ‘bailly de la ? de Clenleu’. She is Péronne’s aunt, so the sister of Philippe.
What does the ‘h.h’ before his name stand for?
In Charles D’aire’s contract, Guillaune Hesdoul is mentioned as “bailli en la
justice patrimonialle dud(it) Clenleu”.

As ever, many thanks for any insights.

[joger]

Ok for Pierre 1 and 2
Guillaume Hesdoul Bailly de la seigneurie de Clanleu

Charles Daire and Jeanne Sanlecque , sa soeur ,this Jeanne is Peronne's sister
The second Jeanne Sanlecque is Guillaume 's wife ( sa fe) and Peronne's  aunt

  h.h , honnête honorable maybe

[goldie61]

Ok for Pierre 1 and 2
Guillaume Hesdoul Bailly de la seigneurie de Clanleu

Charles Daire and Jeanne Sanlecque , sa soeur ,this Jeanne is Paul's sister
The second Jeanne Sanlecque is Guillaume 's wife ( sa fe) and Paul's aunt

  h.h , honnête honorable maybe

Thanks for all this joger.
It still seems odd that Peronne would have two brothers  both called Pierre.
Have you come across this before where two children of the same parents have the same name?

Is 'h.h' a sort of honorific then, given to people in some official capacity to show their standing in the community?
I've seen it written several times in these records - for the surgeon, echervins, and people like Guillaume Hesdoul in this piece.
Perhaps a bit like MPs in the UK. I think I'm right in saying they address each other in Parliament as 'The Honourable Member......'.

Surely the two Jeanne Sanlecques mentioned are relatives of Peronne Sanlecque, and not the groom Paul as you have written. They appear in the listing after her name.

[manukarik]

Nom commun - français

h.h. masculin (pour une femme, on dit : h.f.)

(Généalogie) Abréviation venant qualifier le nom d’un homme afin de souligner qu'il s’agit d'un bourgeois ou d'un notable local.

(Abréviation) De honorable ou honnête homme.

http://blog.ac-versailles.fr/classescopete/public/honnete_homme_synthese.pdf

[goldie61]

Thanks for the information about h.h. manukarik.
That pretty much fits with what I'd thought.

[joger]

About the 2 Pierre : it wasn't unusual for parents to give the same name to several children .
It is possible that the priest himself chose the forename , or the godparents. It depends on the local habits , some parishes had the rule of giving the godparent's name to the  child ( godfather for a boy, godmother for a girl), some had not and let the parents choose .

[joger]

About honest and honorable before a name : nothing is certain concerning the status of the person called honest or honorable , it may be a mark of deference for him ( her), of importance in the parish, or even of the priest's level of importance he gave to the person.

I once found a man called honest and honorable by the priest who lost the priest's  sympathy and was simply called by his name later ( no more money given to the church ? )

[goldie61]

About the 2 Pierre : it wasn't unusual for parents to give the same name to several children .
It is possible that the priest himself chose the forename , or the godparents. It depends on the local habits , some parishes had the rule of giving the godparent's name to the  child ( godfather for a boy, godmother for a girl), some had not and let the parents choose .

That's very interesting joger. Thanks.
Not like English naming then, and certainly not like in Scotland where there was almost a set naming pattern based on the first names of the parents and grandparents - this can be quite helpful when you're trying to find who were the parents of a particular child.
No such help from French naming patterns then!
And for the information about h.h.


Added: I see you have changed 'Paul' in your first reply to 'Peronne'. I thought it must be that. Thanks.