Missing Marriage/1901 Census for William Crean & Ellen Murphy

[Wexflyer]

I just can't seem to find a marriage for this couple, William Crean and Ellen Murphy. Neither can I find them as a couple, or him, in the 1901 census.

William  was born in the Oulart district, 10 Mar 1877. Ellen is also stated to be born Oulart on 1911 English census.

1 Oct 1901 they have a daughter Mary, born Market Sq. Enniscorthy, father publican.
9 Apr 1903 they have a son Richard, also born Market Sq. Enniscorthy, father shopkeeper.

They have at least two further children, born Liverpool, and are in Liverpool in the 1911 census, where the father is, much to my astonishment, now listed as a laborer, married 10 years.

But no sign of a marriage, anywhere in Ireland, or England either. Or in the 1901 census.

Note that both William and Ellen appear in several *incorrect* Ancestry family trees, so don't rely on those!

[Wexflyer]

I have found a candidate for Ellen Murphy though. On the 1901 census, she is residing in Market St., Enniscorthy with her mother, who lists her occupation as "grocery and spirits" - a reasonable match with  the occupations listed for William Crean on the 1901 and 1903 children's birth registrations? [Though selling spirits does not a publican make?]

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/reels/nai001271304/

[softly softly]

clutching at straws re marriage, faint hope for 1901 census

Name   
William Creen
Birth   
abt 1877 Ireland
Residence   
Greenock East, Renfrewshire

8 children as per 1911

Mary 1901
Richard 1903
Nicholas jq 1904  Twin*****sq 1904 aged 0
Anastasia jq 1904  Twin****jq  1904 aged 0
Aidan sq 1905     Twin
Ellen Julia sq 1905 Twin*****sq 1906 aged 1
Ellen jq 1907 *******sq 1909 aged 2
James mq 1911

SS

[Wexflyer]

clutching at straws re marriage, faint hope for 1901 census

Name   
William Creen
Birth   
abt 1877 Ireland
Residence   
Greenock East, Renfrewshire

8 children as per 1911

Mary 1901
Richard 1903
Nicholas jq 1904  Twin*****sq 1904 aged 0
Anastasia jq 1904  Twin****jq  1904 aged 0
Aidan sq 1905     Twin
Ellen Julia sq 1905 Twin*****sq 1906 aged 1
Ellen jq 1907 *******sq 1909 aged 2
James mq 1911

SS

Unfortunately, not the right William. Mine was in Scotland division, Liverpool, with 4 children in 1911.

[softly softly]

Wexflyer, the 8 children are the issue of William Crean/Crane & Ellen Murphy, 2 eldest born Ireland the next 5 born West Derby  and James who was born Liverpool.

SS

[Wexflyer]

Wexflyer, the 8 children are the issue of William Crean/Crane & Ellen Murphy, all born West Derby apart from James who was born Liverpool.

SS

Oh, I misunderstood you. I wonder, are you getting this from Family Search, which is notorious for getting locations wrong.
I have them in the 1911 Census in Liverpool. 8 children. 4 alive, 4 dead. The alive match with 4 of those you posted. Two were actually born Ireland, according to the census, and their GRO birth registrations. They were in Scotland  registration district of Liverpool, which is probably more than enough to throw off Family Search.

Or is there an actual 1911 census return for the same family in Scotland?

[softly softly]

Have amended my post, your family appear in 1911 as you say with 4 children, and again in 1921. I just wanted to list the 4 children who are recorded as deceased in 1911 census for your records.

SS

Or is there an actual 1911 census return for the same family in Scotland?  NO

[Wexflyer]

Links for the children of William Crean and Ellen Murphy born in Enniscorthy

Mary Ellen, 1901
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1901/01930/1747136.pdf

Richard George, 1903
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1903/01866/1726828.pdf

[Wexflyer]

Family of William Crean and Ellen Murphy in Liverpool in 1911 census.
Parents said to be born Oulart - certainly correct for William.
First two children born Enniscorthy, which is also correct.