david price/williams llywel blaenycwm halfway

[coloyounger]

i have a David price born c1846 in traianglas llywel who in the 1851 and 1861 census is a grandson to john Williams of blaenycwm llywel however in 1871 he has moved up to son of john Williams. his marriage certificate to Gwen Williams again gives his father as john Williams of blaencwm llywel. my view on this is that he is possibly the son of Mary Williams born 1826 daughter to john williams and mary thomas who were married in 1826 in llywel, unless there is an older sister to Mary that i have not found yet who either married or had a child by a price and that something happened to them soon after. any help on this would be appreciated.

[Neale1961]

Does he appear in the 51 and 61 census as David Williams or David Price?


Hours later -- Not to worry, I have found him now from 1851 to 1871, but cannot see him after he married. Where was he living in 1881 and after?

[Neale1961]

Your theory about David being the son of Mary Williams is quite feasible. She may not have married to someone called Price, but may have had a son to that person. She was probably (like most young women) employed as a live-in servant, and would not have been in a position to take care of the child, so he would have gone to her parents. In my experience this is quite a common scenario at this time with illegitimate children.
        I see Mary’s baptism on 10 Sept 1826 Llywell in the Independent church. Have you found Mary in the 1841 and 1851 census?

In the 1861 census you will see that in your William’s household there is also a seven-year-old Elizabeth (grand-daughter). It would be worthwhile to explore her origins too.

Some possible records to explore -

Baptism 29 May 1847 (born 13 May) Brecon, St Mary
David Price (base born) son of Mary Price (Servant) – abode Watton Ward

matching birth registration?
PRICE, DAVID       - 
GRO Reference: 1847  J Quarter in BRECKNOCK  Volume 26  Page 299



Baptism 14 Mar 1853 Llywel St David
Elizabeth Williams – daughter of Mary Williams – abode Pendre (Trecastle)

Matching birth registration?
WILLIAMS, ELIZABETH       - 
GRO Reference: 1853  M Quarter in BRECKNOCK  Volume 11B  Page 110

[coloyounger]

He married Gwen Williams in 1873 the marriage cert states his father as John Williams' and living at blaenycwm llywel and they had 9 children ranging from 1870 to 1892 David and Gwen  died in 1920 and 1923.
in the 1881 census it gets a bit complicated as i see it David is still at blaenycwm, Gwen is in Aberdare with her brother joseph and his family with 2 of her children Margaret and David, another 2 of her children Mary and Sarah A are in Myddfai with possibly her sister Margaret.

in 1891 they are living at Bronarthen halfway.

in 1901 still at Bronarthen although written as Fronarthen.

in 1911 halfway Llandovery still Bronarthen.

in 1921 Gwen with children the shop halfway.

they are both buried in Cefnarthen chapel just a couple of miles from halfway.

 
In the 1841 census Mary is living at home in Aberhyddnant near Cray with the rest of the family.

[Neale1961]

He married Gwen Williams in 1873 the marriage cert states his father as John Williams'

David would name is father as John Williams to hide that he was illegitimate. Illegitimacy was a cause of shame, at this time in history. He may never have known his real father's name, and perhaps he never remembered/ knew that he had been called David Price as a young child.

[Greensleeves]

If I could add a little local information here, having lived in Llywel for some years, and thus I know the places mentioned in your posts.
The parish of Llywel consists of the hamlets of Llywel & Halfway and the village of Trecastle plus of course the many farms in the area. One of the interesting things is that there are only three or four surnames as all the original families are interrelated in some way.  Having so few surnames resulted in people being known by their farm or house names rather than their surnames - and this was still the case when I lived there in the 1990s.   We lived at Bear House so my husband was known as Mike the Bear. A friend whose house was next to the public loos was known as Cerys Toilet Cottage.  And one chap was called Dai Bungalow because he had nothing upstairs....

I did start writing a history of the house we lived in which was built, it is thought, in the 1500s.  I'll check through my notes & let you know if I find any mention of the people you're researching.

Kind regards
GS