Immigration records to Scotland early 1900s

[gyoung376]

Good Morning, my Great Grandparents both (separately) emigrated to Scotland (Dundee) from Italy early 1900s. Despite many hours of online searching and emails to the National Records of Scotland I can find no records of their arrival in the UK so am unsure of which ports they will have arrived into. Some Ancestry info has suggested there are no remaining records of internal European migration and I can find no record of them on passenger lists of ships beginning the journey worldwide with European stops.

Can anybody suggest where else to look? Their names were Marianna Visocchi (arrival 1900 - 1904) and Alessandro Tiseo (arrival 1907 - 1910)

[Elwyn Soutter]

In general, passenger lists were only created for intercontinental travel eg Italy to America or London to Australia.  No lists were created for cross Channel routes like Calais – Dover which is perhaps how your ancestors arrived. It strikes me that the quickest and most direct route for them would have been train from Italy to somewhere like Calais (or Zeebrugge, Ostend or Boulogne) and then across to Dover or Folkestone. Then train to London and on to Dundee. A total journey of perhaps 48 hours.

Secondly where they do exist, such immigration records tend to be held by the National Archives in Kew, London because immigration control is a UK wide arrangement.  Scotland does not have it’s own immigration legislation. So National Records of Scotland would not hold that sort of record.

If anything does exist on your ancestors, it might be naturalisation applications (assuming they took out British citizenship) which should be held in Kew. See:

https://www.nationalarchives.gov.uk/help-with-your-research/research-guides/naturalisation-british-citizenship/

[california dreamin]

Good Morning, my Great Grandparents both (separately) emigrated to Scotland (Dundee) from Italy early 1900s. Despite many hours of online searching and emails to the National Records of Scotland I can find no records of their arrival in the UK so am unsure of which ports they will have arrived into. Some Ancestry info has suggested there are no remaining records of internal European migration and I can find no record of them on passenger lists of ships beginning the journey worldwide with European stops.

Can anybody suggest where else to look? Their names were Marianna Visocchi (arrival 1900 - 1904) and Alessandro Tiseo (arrival 1907 - 1910)

Aside from the previous suggestion you might also like to check and see if any Alien Register lists still survive.

CD

[Forfarian]

I see that Alessandro's surname in the index to statutory marriages is Desao, and that he and Marianna were married in Dundee in 1910. Do you have the marriage certificate?

Also, they are in the 1911 and 1921 censuses. The index to the 1921 lists them as Tiseo, in Brechin with five children. In 1911 they are listed as Alexander, Mary Ann and Clementine Desan. Have you seen these?

If you do have these documents, what more do they tell you?

[GR2]

The People's Journal, 22-8-1914:

The Italian community in Dundee make a contribution to the Prince of Wales' Relief Fund. The list of contributors includes:

Alessandro Tiseo 10s.

The Courier, 3-5-1915:

SERIOUS ASSAULT ON ITALIAN IN DUNDEE. -
Bailie Barnes at Dundee on Saturday remitted
Clessandro (sic) Tiseo (32), confectioner, 152 Hill-
town, to the Sheriff on a charge of assaulting
Peter Nazario, confectioner, 18 Princes Street,
with his fist and a glass bottle. In moving
the remit, the Fiscal stated that Nazario had
sustained a fractured skill, and was lying in
the Royal Infirmary in an unconscious con-
dition.

The Evening Telegraph, 18-7-1922:

GAMING MACHINE IN REFRESHMENT
                      SHOP
    Italian Proprietor Charged With
                  Illegal Use.
  Pleading guilty at Dundee Police Court
to-day to having permitted a gaming
machine to be used in her shop at 14 Brook
Street, Marianna Visocchi or Tiseo (42), 16
Brook Street, was fined 40s, with the alter-
native of twenty-days' imprisonment.
  Mr A. Bell said that it was quite legal
to allow the machine to be used for amuse-
ment, but it was illegal where a prize in
money or kind was awarded or forfeited
consequent on the result of the operation of
the machine, whether the operation was
automatic or not.
  When the police entered accused's shop on
Sunday, July 9, they found a number of
lads who had lost money operating the
machine.

Evening Telegraph, 27-6-1935:

(under "Dundee Police Court Today")

An ice-cream vendor, Alexandro Tiseo,
100 Brook Street, was fined 10s for failing
to have a license (sic) for his motor-cycle ice-
cream carrier combination.

The Courier, 11-7-1947:

(under "Lost or Found")

LOST Tues. afternoon, small brooch, between
    Guthrie St. and Bank St., Lochee (via Lochee
    tram). C. Tiseo, 100 Brook St.

[amondg]

National Archives
Home Office. Aliens Department, Internal Detainees
Ref: HO 396/212

Alessandro Tiseo  born Caserta Italy DOB 15-4-1883 of 100 Brook Street Dundee.
I D Number T8953

Interred released 18 Feb. 1941, reinterred 25 April 1941 he refused to sign. There is an additional entry 1943

The card index is on Find MY Past.
The National Archives should be able to provide more information. 

[amondg]

The Evening Telegraph 26 July 1929

Suddenly of the 25th at D.R.I. Marianna Visocchi, wife of Alexander Tiseo. Funeral at St. Andrew's Pro Catholic 1pm Saturday 27th.

[gyoung376]

Thanks everyone, I already had all of the info provided and have tried all the suggested sites. I just wondered if there were any incoming passenger records so I locate year of immigration for both and confirm definite spelling of surname for GGF.

[Elwyn Soutter]

Thanks everyone, I already had all of the info provided and have tried all the suggested sites. I just wondered if there were any incoming passenger records so I locate year of immigration for both and confirm definite spelling of surname for GGF.

I think it’s fairly safe to assume there are no passenger lists for their arrivals. Passenger arrivals records were not routinely kept on the routes they are likely to have taken.

You might find dates of arrival in the UK from the various TNA sources quoted in this series of posts but that may involve going to TNA at Kew (or getting a researcher to do it for you) as the detailed records may not be on-line.

I wouldn’t focus too much on any “definite spelling of surname” as many folk were not very literate but also frequently indifferent to how their name was spelled. Spelling varied all the time in that era according to who provided the information.  Expect it to vary.