Tracing an illusive Railway employee, London, 1930s

[BobB1]

Hi.

I have been desperately trying to find information on my 90 year old Mother's late Father; Alfred (Albert) Wilson - born circa 1900.

All we know so far is that in the 1930 -1941 period, he lived in and around a number of St Pancras/Euston addresses (4 of which we know the details) and states on his children's birth certificates 'Dining Car Attendant'.

From this we assume a railway employee/worker. Mother's childhood memory says he may have also worked on the 'Flying Scotstman' as a dining car steward. LNER?

I'm hoping that by confirming his employment history, I might be able to back track to discover more.

Strangely, I can find no mention of him on the 1939 Register either.

Short of a long and possibly fruitless journey to the National Archives, does anyone have suggestion how this illusive man might be tracked down?

Are there local London Rail history buffs out there who could help/advise?

Thanks

Bob

[mazi]

Hi bob andwelcome to rootschat

From what I can see restaurant car staff were part of the railway hotels staff so not listed under the usual categories but classed as auxiliary staff.

Searching the nat.archives for “railway hotel staff” did not turn up much, if he was in a trade union warwick university have a lot of trade union records.

He likely spent a lot of his working life going up to Scotland one day, lodging overnight and returning the next day on the return working

Others may have more info as most digitised railway records are available on anc. or FindMyPast

Mike

[Ashtone]

There's a 1934 London newspaper report about a "dining car attendant in the employment of the L & NE Railway Company at Marylebone Station". So it appears they were railway staff at the time.

Have you tried cross-referencing your grandfather's known addresses with the 1939 Register?
Is his wife/family missing from the 1939 Register, or just him? Do you have him in any census records?

[mckha489]

What name and occupation does he give for his father on his marriage certificate?

[softly softly]

Hi, welcome to rootschat, in trying to narrrow down the search,do you know(a)when grandfather died and where (B) what was your mothers maiden surname(C) what was his date of birth,ie day/month.

SS

[Jebber]

Just a suggestion, have you considered that if he was born c1900 he would have been eligible for war service? If he was already called up he won’t appear in the 1939 Register. The Register was for the issue of identity cards and ration books for civilians. The
 services had their own system so many men do not appear on the Register.

[BobB1]

Wow, I can see I have come to the right place. Thank you all for the considered responses.

To clarify the questions raised:

1. He uses Alfred and Albert interchangeably as Christian name

2. We only have Alf's death certificate. Died 1943 in St Mary's hospital, Luton of TB. Occupation says 'Engineers Labourer' (Waiter) - no other helpful information is contained in this certificate.

3. We have been unable to identify an exact birth date or a certificate because we are unsure of location of birth or actual year/month and even his name (see later). We only surmise his 1943 death which gives his age of 43 was accurately recorded - hence circa 1900.

4. Ditto for war record; nothing to start a search. Unless he can be traced as having signed up in 1939 and a link to his employment and known address can be cross referenced? He certainly isn't on the 1939 Register, so how he would have managed without an ID card or ration card is unknown - unless he was by then signed up? Perhaps he tried to join but was medically discharged with signs of the impending TB? He is later in 1940 at Arlington Road

5 His partner with whom he had 4 children was Martha (Madge) Wentworth born 1902 - both used the surname of Wilson, but there is no evidence of a marriage actually taking place. Therefore no more information there.

6. The 1931 census was virtually destroyed, and the 1911 and 1921 census has so far shown nothing that I can obviously see - but I'm no expert at this.

7. On 3 children's birth certificates he states he was at the following addresses?
    a. 1934 - 166 Hampstead Road, St Pancras
    b. 1938 - 2 Dalby Street (NW5?)
    c. 1940 - 220 Arlington Road, Camden.

8. My Mother recalls he often would bring home 'cakes and sandwiches' after a shift for they were mightily grateful as times were hard. This seems to tie in with a waiter or restaurant car attendant.

Now to complicate matters. It is just possible that Wilson was an assumed name. 'Madge' suffered from Alzheimer's and in a moment of lucidity, blurted out 'you won't find him - he was a Speers). Variants of Speirs/Spiers/Spears - plural and singular have so far not produced anything. If it's true, did he use this 'given name' for official documentation and or employment?

It's a picture of a man who is avoiding something. But I'm convinced if I can track down his railway employment and or potential 1939 military registration, it will produce leads to follow.

Grateful for any more input/advice or assistance.

Bob

[Girl Guide]

Did your mother have any siblings who are now deceased?  If so have you tried finding them on the 1939 Register?

Do you know when Alfred married and if so to whom?

[Girl Guide]

Below is information from the Britain, Trade Union Membership Registers, Clerkenwell, Middlesex, England.

It may have nothing to do with your Alfred but I thought I would provide this for information only.

First name(s) Alfred
Last name Wilson
Birth year 1901
Age 15
Admission year 1916
Occupation/grade Van guard
Trade Railway Workers
Union name National Union Of Railwaymen

The full details can be found on Find My Past.