Two missing Popes

[overlandermatt]

I'm trying to track down two Popes from the 1830s and 40s. There were 10 children born to William Pope b Langport Somerset 1811 and Mary Ann (Martin) between 1834 and 1859. I have details about 8 of them but I am missing some fundamentals about two...

Eliza Pope born 14th Jan 1846. She appears at the family home in East Stonehouse 1851 and 1861 (2 Quarry Street) then the trail goes a bit cold. The family was very much a Royal Marine family and the girls tended to marry marines.

William Pope appears on the 1841 census but his parents were not married at that time. They probably lived in Stoke Damerel at the time of the birth and were married in Stoke Damerel church in 1838. William does not appear again on any other census connected to the family. Typically boys would join the Royal Marines at the age of 14 as his brother George (b 1838) did. I believe there was a Sergeant William Pope that earned a long service good conduct medal at approximately the right time as this William would have if he did indeed join the Marines.

Any suggestions on where to look next much appreciated.

[CaroleW]

Re Eliza Pope - Have you already investigated the 1869 marriage in Somerset?

If William was illegit - was William snr his father? If not - could  he have become William Martin as an adult?

[overlandermatt]

No I've not investigated the Somerset marriage lead. Indeed I have not even found that one. Do you have any further info please - I don't seem to have come up with anything...

As for William Pope, I will look into the possibility of a surname Martin. He is a Pope in the 1841 census but that really is the only link that this person exists... I wonder whether the church baptisms records might be a help. I found his brother in a later baptisms book and I think they lived in the same area.

Thanks again.

Matt

[CaroleW]

Per freebmd

Dec qtr 1869 Eliza Pope Sherborne 5A 782 - possible spouses William Biss or Robert Burrows

[overlandermatt]

Thanks for that! Actually I think I had spotted that one - I think it's Dorset.

[osprey]

1871 census in Sherborne, Eliza wife of Robert Burrows is 21 and born Sherborne. So doesn't look to be your girl.

Marriage in Stoke Damerel 11 Feb 1862
John Cox alias Henry Hollay of age bach marine HMS Lapwing father James Hollay labourer
Eliza Pope minor spinster Chapel St father William Pope sailor
witnesses William Pope & Emma Pope

2 possible births
Florence M Cox 1866 mmn Pope
Eliza Lavinia Cox 1864 mmn Pope - burial Ford Park Cemetery 2 June 1866 address 2 Quarry Lane Stonehouse

Eliza then remarries march qtr 1868 East Stonehouse vol 5b pg 493 with a John Lewis on the same page

1871 census 2 Quarry St (same building as William Pope & family)
Eliza Lewis 26 wife of a marine
Emily Cox dau 3
C W Lewis son 2
all born Stonehouse

birth regs
Emily Holly Cox dec qtr 1867 mmn Tope (!)
Charles William Lewis june qtr 1869 mmn Pope

One of the witnesses on Rosina Pope's 1871 marriage is Eliza Lewis.

[osprey]

baptism Stoke Damerel
12 Jan 1834 William son of Mary Ann Martin, spinster, Devonport.

Marriages
possible first marriage
Stoke Damerel 19 Oct 1858
William Pope 24 bach Royal Marine HMS Exmouth father William Pope cook's mate
Mary Putt 22 spinster 57 Fore St father George Putt postman
witnesses William Pope & George Pope

East Stonehouse 12 May 1873
William Martin Pope 39 widower pensioner Stonehouse father William Pope pensioner
Ellen Ramsay 39 widow Stonehouse father John Weekes pensioner
witnesses Selina Pope & Geo. M Pope

[overlandermatt]

1871 census in Sherborne, Eliza wife of Robert Burrows is 21 and born Sherborne. Do doesn't look to be your girl.

Marriage in Stoke Damerel 11 Feb 1862
John Cox alias Henry Hollay of age bach marine HMS Lapwing father James Hollay labourer
Eliza Pope minor spinster Chapel St father William Pope sailor
witnesses William Pope & Emma Pope

2 possible births
Florence M Cox 1866 mmn Pope
Eliza Lavinia Cox 1864 mmn Pope - burial Ford Park Cemetery 2 June 1866 address 2 Quarry Lane Stonehouse

Eliza then remarries march qtr 1868 East Stonehouse vol 5b pg 493 with a John Lewis on the same page

1871 census 2 Quarry St (same building as William Pope & family)
Eliza Lewis 26 wife of a marine
Emily Cox dau 3
C W Lewis son 2
all born Stonehouse

birth regs
Emily Holly Cox dec qtr 1867 mmn Tope (!)
Charles William Lewis june qtr 1869 mmn Pope

One of the witnesses on Rosina Pope's 1871 marriage is Eliza Lewis.

Thank you Osprey. That is pretty remarkable. How on earth did you find all this? I have Ancestry and FindMyPast subscriptions and I did not get far.

Most of these links make sense. I'm interested to know why she is described as a minor at her wedding. She had recently turned 18. William Pope witness is father or brother. The father had left the marines by that date. George Pope is the brother. Is that wedding entry on line for Stoke Damerel?

Potential children match family names. Address at Quarry St is a match.

Where do you find the burial information? The Ford Park Cemetery was the main one in that part of the city. I've often wondered where they were all buried. I'd be keen to investigate. The only confirmed burial I had there was William Pope the father.

Thanks so much Osprey. Greatly appreciate your help.

[osprey]

the marriage details and burials at Ford Park are on Findmypast. Marriage details are under parish marriages which have the same details as marriage certificates and also the original signatures.
I'd spotted her marriage but couldn't find her in 1871, then noticed the Eliza witness on Rosina's marriage and found the census entry.
Some entries are also on FamilySearch - Eliza's first marriage
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KC9C-DWV

The Ford Park burials are under parish burials. It's only an index but address is included.

Eliza was 16 at the time of her first marriage. Full age was 21 so under that would be noted as minor.

Is this George's marriage to Emma Helman?
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KC9Y-5PL

and his baptism
https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:KC99-1YG