Alexander Grierson

[wyanga]

Forfarian
               I had taken that it meant Wigtown on Wigtown bay. I understand that this was the home area of the McGregor clan and at some stage in History the English banned the clan and the McGregor name and that families in the area chose to adobt variations such as Gregson and Grierson among other variations. Forgive me if my Scottish history and geography is hazy.
  I understand that Wigtown is near the boundary between Gallway and Dumfries
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[wyanga]

CaroleW
                 I was unaware that ages were rounded down in the 1851 Census. This would explain other differences in ages that I have had with other Scottish ancesters.
  Also my other Gt Grandmother Ann Taylor had reverted to her maiden name of Wilson in the 1881 Census in Glasgow . So I was not surprised by Helen Grierson  reverting to her maiden name of McKellar in the 1861 census.
She was the daughter of Peter McKellar and Margaret Campbell. He was a shepherd at Cuil near Barracaber in Argyll.
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[CaroleW]

Rounded down in the 1841 census - not the 1851

[wyanga]

Forfarian
              The naming of Wigton Dumpfries in the 1851 census creates a real problem and combined with the variation in the ages given it looks to me as if it will be impossible to follow this family any further back. We could never be sure just who his parents might be.
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[Forfarian]

I understand that Wigtown is near the boundary between Gallway and Dumfries

Well, not exactly.

Wigtown is indeed on Wigtown Bay, but it is in the historic county of Wigtown. The next county to the east is Kirkcudbright, and the next one after that is Dumfries.

Galloway (not to be confused with Galway which is in Ireland) is the part of south-west Scotland west of the River Nith, which flows through the burgh (town) of Dumfries. At Dumfries itself, the Nith also forms the boundary between Kirkcudbrightshire and Dumfries-shire, so part of the present town is actually in the historic county of Kirkcudbrightshire.

So Galloway effectively covers the counties of Wigtown and Kirkcudbright, and the parish and burgh of Wigtown is not actually near the boundary with Dumfries-shire. It is quite close to the boundary between Wigtownshire and Kirkcudbrightshire.

In 1975 the Powers That Be thought fit, for administrative purposes, to sweep away all the historic counties and replace them with a new set of local authorities. One of those new local authorities is called Dumfries and Galloway, and covers the same area as the three counties already mentioned.

So for historical purposes, like genealogy, you need to concentrate on the historic counties, because all the records until 1975 were collected on the basis of those counties. You also need to be aware of the importance of parishes in finding your way around the older records.

The screenshot is a map which might help. It's from https://maps.nls.uk/view/00000262, and dates from the early 18th century.

[Forfarian]

I understand that this was the home area of the McGregor clan and at some stage in History the English banned the clan and the McGregor name and that families in the area chose to adobt variations such as Gregson and Grierson among other variations.

Where do I start?

Galloway is not, strictly and historically speaking, clan territory. Originally the clans were a social feature of the Highlands, not of the Lowlands and south of Scotland, though the concept of clanship has now spread to the most significant families in the Lowlands and south of Scotland.

The heartlands of Clan Gregor were further north, in Perthshire and Argyll, and there are no records at all of baptisms, marriages or burials of M*cGr*g*rs in the county of Wigtown before 1766. (There is one record of a Grierson in 1706.)

It is true that the surname MacGregor was proscribed, that many MacGregors were forced to change their surnames, and that Grierson and Gregson were among the names adopted.

However this cannot be blamed on the English government, because the original edict was pronounced by King James VI (who subsequently became King James I of England) in 1603, and was restated by an Act of the Scottish Parliament in 1617. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clan_Gregor

On the other hand, according to G F Black's The Surnames of Scotland the Griersons of Lag, Dumfries-shire, claim descent from Malcolm, dominus de MacGregor, who died in 1374, but he goes on to say that Col Fergusson's Lairds of Lag says, 'There is no evidence or foundation for the story that this family was an offshoot of the Highland family of MacGregor'.

There are records of Griersons dating back to the 15th century, mostly from Dumfries and Galloway, so not all Griersons were proscribed MacGregors, and in particular I see no reason to think that your Alexander G was descended from a proscribed MacGregor.

(You could try to blame the banning of tartan and bagpipes among other things after the 1745 Jacobite Rising on the English Government, except that by then the parliaments of Scotland and England were united (1707) so it was the United Kingdom Parliament that was responsible for that edict.)

[Forfarian]

The naming of Wigton Dumpfries in the 1851 census creates a real problem and combined with the variation in the ages given it looks to me as if it will be impossible to follow this family any further back. We could never be sure just who his parents might be.

A couple of things.

First, I am pretty sure that we are all relying on transcriptions of that 1851 census. You should take a look at the original, just to be sure that it does actually say Wigton and Dumfries. Both enumerators and transcribers can make errors.

Second, don't give up without at least asking if the Archives has the Parochial Board record that must have existed for Alexander Grierson. If it has survived, it should tell you his parish of birth, and it may name his parents.

[Kay99]

I couldn't resist looking at the 1851 census image earlier

[wyanga]

Forfarian
              Thank you for taking the time to update me on the History of the counties and parishes.
I had done a search on maps and had arrived at an understanding of the area. Also for the McGregor family History.
   We are still left with the problem of the 1851 Census as Kay99 has kindly shown it is definately recorded as Wigton. My thoughts on this are that there were Census collectors who wrote down what they thought they heard the individual say, speech and accent could very well have made Wigtown sound like Wigton. But that doesn't alter the fact that it is not in Dumfrieshire. He was at that time an old man and maybe was confused in his thinking.
   As you say trying to see if there are any records surviving for the pauper payments in the Dunoon Parish might be my only avenue left. Alexander's wife Helen was also listed as a pauper in the 1861 Census, she had also reverted to her maiden name of McKellar in that census and was living with a sister at Ardentinny
   There were too many Peter McKellars in the area for me to be able to find his parents but i had more success with his wife Margaret Campbell who came from Lochgoilhead. Again I had to negotiate a change of names . her father was Duncan Campbell and wife Nancy McKoel but the McKoel name was dropped and they reverted to the sept name McNaughton. They were narried in 1775. I was able to trace Duncan Campbell back to a Donald Campbell at Guananbeg Argyll
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