Gifford of Norwich

[dee Veit]

Hello, I am not sure if anyone can help but I am working on a specific family of John Herbert Gifford m. Mary Anne Payne.  He died in '36 and I have looked at 1911 and 1921 and 1939 census work. 
I have four children Charles JP Gifford b.1903 who is out of the house by '39.  Then Henry Wells Gifford b.1905, third child is Arthur E Gifford b. 1906 and youngest is Emily Ada Gifford b.1909. 

My question is this; the 1939 census shows two lines below Emily Ada that are obscured.  I think she never married but may have had children.  I wish I could find out more about Emily Ada's family from Norwich, Norfolk.  Thank you to any reply, Deanna

[mckha489]

We aren’t allowed to trace living people on Rootschat.
If they are still blacked out it means their births were less than 100 years ago.

They might have had evacuees with them. Or other young members of the family.  Could be anyone.

However, on FindMyPast one has been unredacted (they do theirs monthly I think, whereas ancestry do it annually). Anyway

It is Marjorie  P Gifford dob 20 Dec 1920 (20 Dec 21 has been written above)
Then Gifford  crossed out and replaced with ROHRER

Marriage June 1943.  Rohrer    Earl P    Gifford    Norwich    4b   392

[mckha489]

She was Marjorie Payne Gifford
Earl was Earl Pershing Rohrer

https://www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/1:1:QVY5-BLFW

Cannot see a birth for her though.
I don’t think she is the Stoke on Trent one.  There is a matching death for that.

Ah - her naturalization documents (USA) say she was née PAYNE. Born Leicester. Back to the 1920 year of birth.
3 sons.  R.J.,  M.A & S.E.  (Full names on document, but probably still living)


There is this possible birth……

PAYNE, MARJORIE       CROFTS 
GRO Reference: 1920  D Quarter in LEICESTER  Volume 07A  Page 404

I can see her on the 1921 you will already have looked at. (The lodger)


She died 13 Oct 2007, and it looks as thought there is quite a long obit for her, but I don’t have a sub to those papers.  Hopefully someone who does will see this thread.  Or….if you have never subscribed I think you can have a 7 day free trial.

https://www.newspapers.com/    She is Margie Rohrer in that according to the index.

Adding. Here is the obit. https://www.legacy.com/us/obituaries/herald/name/margerie-rohrer-obituary?id=13497308

[mckha489]

Might be death of mother

June qrtr 1921, Leicester . Payne    Edith M    34    Leicester    7a   179

[mckha489]

I wonder if she had a sister

PAYNE, DORIS  MARY     CROFTS 
GRO Reference: 1915  J Quarter in LEICESTER  Volume 07A  Page 350

[ciderdrinker]

Hi
The parents for Marjorie are Herbert Payne and Fanny Elizabeth Crofts who married 1903.
He gives his father as George William Payne and was b c 1882 at Gaddesley. Struggling to see the family before 1903 and tie him into Mary Ann Payne /Gifford.

bapt 9.4.1882 Gaddesley Herbert s of George William Payne and Mary groom.

Ciderdrinker

[mckha489]

her parents are Edgar Payne and Edith Crofts.  They married in 1915
I presume Edgar is Mary Ann Gifford’s brother

See the obituary in reply #2

[amondg]

1891 census Wright Street Leicester.
Reuben Payne 49 Frame Work Knitter
Mary Ann  49
Reuben 18   Shoe Finisher
Susan Emma 20     B--? Hand
George 16   Clicker
John Henry 14  scholar
*Mary Ann 12   scholar
Clara Adelaide 10   scholar
Arthur E 8    scholar
*Edgar 3
-----------------------
Clara her sister was a witness to the marriage of John Herbert Gifford to Mary Ann  Payne 1 February 1903 St John the Divine, Leicester.
Other witnesses were Frederick Thomas Gifford and Robert Tansley Payne.

ADDED
Going back to 1881 census Robert Tansley Payne is an older brother.

[amondg]

1901 census the family are at 46 Muriel Road Leicester. The father Reuben has died, Mary Ann is a widow born Enderby Leicester.