Elizabeth Saunders 1860-1940 born Swansea

[dmerry]

I am trying to find the names of the parents and birth of Elizabeth Saunders born in Swansea.  From research so far this is the information I have.

Elizabeth Saunders married Peter Cunningham on 28 May 1881 in Merthyr Tydfil and lists her father as John Saunders.  On the 1891 Census Elizabeth is with her husband Peter who has taken the surname Gardner using the Welsh patronymic system. On the 1891 Census they are living at 81 Taff Street, Merthyr Vale, on the 1901 21 Taff Street and on the 1911 Census 18 Bryntaff Road.  On all these census' she is listed as born in Swansea but I just cannot find her.

On the 1891 Census it also lists her mother as Ann Saunders born in Exeter, Devon.  I have located an Ann John born in Exeter with a daughter Elizabeth John born in Swansea on the 1881 Census living at 11 Ynysgau, Merthyr Tydfil living next door to Peter Gardner (her future husband).  On the 1871 Census Ann John is living with a John Teague along with three children John John aged 14, Elizabeth John aged 11 and Lydia John 8. 

So I am very confused as to how all this works a I just cannot find a birth for Elizabeth in the Swansea area and also cannot find a marriage for her parents.  Any help would be gratefully received.

[rosie99]

What was her address when she got married

Who were the witnesses

[CaroleW]

If she only died in 1940 she should be on the 1939 register which will give you her full birthdate

She died as Gardener March qtr 1840

Using her birthdate on the 1939 register there is a possible match for her birth on freebmd in the June qtr 1860 Merthyr T

GRO online shows mmn as John

[osprey]

details from parish marriage
28 May 1881
Peter Cuningham 21 bach labourer Merthyr Tydfil father Peter Cuningham, pedlar
Elizabeth Saunders 21 spinster Merthyr Tydfil father John Saunders engineer
witnesses John Thomas & William Hope, Peter & John signed.

If he were using a patronymic name he would be Peter Peter. Patronymics were no longer in use at that time. 

[CaroleW]

Using her mothers details on the 1891 entry - have you traced backwards using the 1871?

[CaroleW]

1871 - all surname John & living as lodgers with a John Teague - married - aged 63 - no wife shown

Ann 43 b Exeter
John 14 b Newport Monmouth
Elizabeth 11 b Swansea
Lydia 8 b Merthyr

And now the best bit - living next door are Charlotte Gardner/W John Cunningham & Peter Cunningham

Piece 5394/78/28

There is a Lydia John birth in 1863 on freebmd but mmn is Morgan
John John 1857 mmn Morgan

[osprey]

birth reg of Charlotte Cuningham in 1891 has mmn of John

[CaroleW]

May be a good idea to get a digital copy of the 1857 birth cert for John John or the 1863 for Lydia & see whether there is a fathers name/occupation

[dmerry]

Thank you for all your ideas.  In answer to one of your questions I have not been able to go back further than 1871.

It is interesting to see Elizabeth Saunders has a maiden name of John.  If that is the middle child on the 1871 Census then why has her older brother and younger sister's birth record have a maiden name of Morgan? umm.