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Richard Smith born 1750? +/- 5 buried 1820 Bidston (Confirmed by the Cheshire Parish Project Register Database (CPPRD)) married to Ann/Nancy Linacre 1775 Bidston (Confirmed by the (CPPRD) one witness was a John Smith (confirmed by CPPRD) possibly his father.
 One of Richard`s daughters Betty was baptized 1779 (confirmed by CPRD)  and the names of Richard`s parents were given as John & Mary as additional information, confirmation that his father was John.
However I cannot find a suitable marriage for a John Smith & Mary around a suitable time probably a few years +/- 1750 however I have not been able to find the baptism of Richard Smith or his siblings either.
I am presuming he would have not have  had a trade (he signs the marriage register for his son Richard with a X) however his grand son William Smith born 1783 (confirmed by CPPRD) lists himself as a farmer in the 1841 census, so perhaps John Smith was an agricultural labourer?
There are some entries on family history trees on Ancestry for marriages of John Smith to a Mary, one for instance to a Mary Moss, one tree even has John marrying her twice in his lifetime.
However there is no supporting documentation to prove any of them.
Does anyone have any ideas as to where I could find a suitable marriage for a John Smith & a Mary?

Hi

I have posted before about this person  http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=792517.msg6487338#msg6487338

I am just trying to get more information on him from a different angle.

Can anyone find him in a trade directory between 1861 and 1876 ?

 ShaunJ  found that a Jonathan Smith carter, "was charged by Inspector Crafter, of the Royal Society for the Prevention of Cruelty to Animals with working a lame horse, he was fine3d 10s & costs" (Liverpool Mercury 4 October 1876) I am presuming this is my Jonathan Smith.

To recap he married Emma Roberts 15th June 1862 at St Nicholas Liverpool occupation carter, I know no more about him other than his father was given as Richard a labourer.

He is not the son of Richard & Ann Oxton b 1840 as this person marries a Sarah & dies in 1876 (unless he had a bigamous marriage or she has just took his name)
He is not the son of Richard & Ann Smith b 1841 Barnston as this person his living with his wife Ellen in 1881 at 37 Mill St Tranmere. (again I am presuming he has not made a bigamous marriage nor has the lady just took his name.)
Jonathan`s wife Emma is living with her daughter in Bury for the 1871 census  in 1881 she is living with Michael Fanning in Birkenhead.
I am unable to find a suitable death entry for him either.
Any ideas are welcome.

I have posted previously about Johnathan Smith on this forum a couple of days ago, and established that he was born in Oxton Cheshire 1840 to Richard & Ann Smith, he was with his parents in the 1851, 1861,1871 census can anyone work out where he was for the 1881 & 1891 census?

I have asked about her twice before on RootsChat (links below) in 2014 & 2015
I thought I would put it out to this forum in case anyone has any new ideas.

http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=717223.0
http://www.rootschat.com/gorum/inex.php?topic=680593.18

It is also on the Staffordshire one at the moment http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=769526.new;topicseen#new


Just to recap her life events

Census 1851 Colshaw Hollingsclough with Helen Lomas (Pheobe aged 7)
Census 1861   Colshaw Hollingsclough with Helen Lomas (Pheobe aged 17)
Census  1871  Colshaw Hollingsclough with Helen Lomas
Census 1881 Winterside Hollingsclough
Census 1891 Hope Cottage
1901 Chapel en le Frith
1911 School House Burbage (visitor) to Urban & Mary Jane Flander

1st Marriage 1864 Earl Standon Derbyshire to Isaac Wain
2nd Marriage 1879 Burbage to William Bennet

Her children are Ann 1865      from Isaac Wain
         Fredrick 1869, Ellen 1872, Ernest 1874 (unknown fathers)
John 1882, George 1883, William 1889 from William Bennet

From the information above I estimate that she was born 1843/44/45 (she was 20 at her 1st marriage in 1864

In the censuses she says she is born in Leek sometimes she just has Derbys (I presume for Derbyshire)

Since the last request I have bought Pheobe`s1st marriage certificate, there is no entry for her father and the witness are Joseph Goodwin & Harriet Wain(both her husbands relatives)
She also does not provide her fathers name on her second marriage.
I have also had  Staffordshire Archives to check to see if she was born in a Staffordshire workhouse, they could find no record. They also checked the BTs for Hartington & Earl Sterndale 1840 – 1850 but without success

Perhaps if she is the witness at some one else's wedding this could prove a link with a relative but I have not found anything like that yet.
Any ideas on how to connect her with some relative would be welcome, I was thinking there must be some other official records that she could be on

Hi I have posted this query before but just perhaps someone may have a fresh angle on this query that I have.

 Jonathan Smith married Emma Roberts in Liverpool (St Nicholas) in 1862.
They are not together in the 1871 census only Emma with her daughter Emma who is only a few months old.
 I think that they may have met in Bury as Emma is living there as a servant in the 1861 Census.
There was also a John Smith living nearby in the 1861 census of Bury.
However in the 1881 Census Emma is living as Emma Fanning with Michael Fanning at 3 Elizabeth St Birkenhead. (she was originally from Thurstaston), however I am unable to find a marriage for these two.
So it makes me think that Jonathan may still be alive or they chose not to marry?
I haven`t found a death record for Johnathon that seems to fit for him.

Marriage details of Emma Roberts and Johnathon Smith:  15th June 1862 St Nicholas, Liverpool

Jonathan Smith of full age, a carter. Father: Richard Smith labourer.
Emma Roberts of full age. Father: Edward Roberts, stonemason
Witnesses: William and Jane Hughes

Earlier thread re the family http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index.php?topic=741998.msg5886744#msg5886744